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NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread - Page 216

post #3226 of 27247
Quote:
Originally Posted by sexandcandy View Post
scottie brooks was a PG. pretty sure he favors westbrook and is telling him to take shots over durant. no other explanation

Brooks said publicly after game 4 or 5 that Westbrook was taking too many jumpers. Durant's also looked pissed more than a few times going into timeouts after RW has been hogging the ball.
post #3227 of 27247
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjmin209 View Post
Brooks said publicly after game 4 or 5 that Westbrook was taking too many jumpers. Durant's also looked pissed more than a few times going into timeouts after RW has been hogging the ball.

The NBA is, from a coaching perspective, one of the stupidest leagues in sport. It's the only place where coaches regularly allow and encourage their players not to put the ball in the hands of their best player.
post #3228 of 27247
Thread Starter 
^^^ Not true. If Westbrook chooses to hold the ball til there is 5 seconds left in the clock, then there is nothing the coach could especially since he is the second best player in the team. He can't take him out, the same way you can't take Dirk out if he starts the game shooting 1-10 or Rose shooting 30% on the floor. You have to have your stars out there and Westbrook is just that, sadly he is still immature and still plays those fools in the park that always shoot when you play pick-ups game.

Dallas, Chicago, Miami and Lakers constantly get the ball to their stars.
post #3229 of 27247
Also, Memphis--especially Battier--has done a great job defending Durant & denying him the ball. On several plays in last night's game, you could see that Westbrook tried (initially) to get KD the ball, but gave up early & then took the solo route.
post #3230 of 27247
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjmin209 View Post
Also, Memphis--especially Battier--has done a great job defending Durant & denying him the ball. On several plays in last night's game, you could see that Westbrook tried (initially) to get KD the ball, but gave up early & then took the solo route.

Exactly. Battier is locking Durant down and Durant doesn't have a varied enough offensive game to overcome Battier's stifling defense. For all the hype and accolades given to him Durant's game is still very limited. He is not the strongest dribbler and cannot consistently create his own shot. Durant is primarily a catch and shoot scorer, almost akin to a taller Reggie Miller. At times he can get free on backscreens, cuts, pindowns and score in the paint and he can also sometimes slash to the rim with a quick first step but by and large teams can control him if they have a dedicated defender (Battier, Artest, etc...).

Westbrook is very athletic and supremely talented but he can be a shotjacker at times and make terrible decisions. However, I feel most of the blame for Durant not getting enough shots falls on no one but himself. Many people will tell you Durant is better than Carmelo Anthony but to me Melo blows him out of the water. Anthony can create his own shot, play in the post, catch and shoot, etc... Durant's lack of strength really hurts him when being guarded by physical players and teams. He can be shut down. If his jumpshot isn't falling he doesn't have anything else to fall back on. Durant needs to work on his dribbling skills during the offseason. If he was better at creating his own shot he wouldn't have to rely on Westbrook to get him the ball and he could take over the game whenever he wanted...
post #3231 of 27247
I agree that Durant is not wanting or demanding the ball enough and letting himself be taken out of games. I don't agree that he doesn't have the skills. His dribbling is not fancy, but he can get by someone if he wants, or create space to shoot. And there's no way to deny a guy the ball for long if the team is committed to getting it to him. Best example would be the plays Boston runs for Paul Pierce at the end of games or the Wade iso plays in the pre big 3 days. Westbrook is being a jackass and Durant and Brooks are letting him. MJ or Kobe woulda grabbed him by the throat if he froze him out like that. even in the Reggie Miller comparison, you wouldn't dare not pass Reggie the ball once he worked himself free off a screen
post #3232 of 27247
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRoi View Post
I agree that Durant is not wanting or demanding the ball enough and letting himself be taken out of games. I don't agree that he doesn't have the skills. His dribbling is not fancy, but he can get by someone if he wants, or create space to shoot. And there's no way to deny a guy the ball for long if the team is committed to getting it to him. Best example would be the plays Boston runs for Paul Pierce at the end of games or the Wade iso plays in the pre big 3 days.

Westbrook is being a jackass and Durant and Brooks are letting him. MJ or Kobe woulda grabbed him by the throat if he froze him out like that. even in the Reggie Miller comparison, you wouldn't dare not pass Reggie the ball once he worked himself free off a screen

He doesn't have the skills yet. He comes off screens and catches and shoots or catches and makes a quick move and shoots. How many times do you see OKC give him the ball in iso situations? How many times do they post him up? Every now and then he scores in situations like these (esp. if he has a advantage like if a big man or smaller player has been switched on him) but he is much more comfortable shooting jumpshots. A dedicated defender can stop him because they aren't going to let him go by them and they force him to what he wants to do except they do a great job contesting it. OKC pushed the Lakers in the playoffs last year not because of Durant (who shot a poor percentage and was taken out of his game by Artest) but because Westbrook shredded their defense over and over.

You can't compare what Boston runs for Pierce and what Miami runs for Wade because both of them are very capable ball handlers who can create their own shots. They each are capable of getting a rebound and dribbling the ball down the court and creating for themselves or their teammates. If Pierce isn't getting the ball enough from Rondo he can get the ball and do his own thing. Durant has not shown the ability to do this. He needs help and gets the bulk of his scoring opportunities through the offensive scheme. This is what separates the very good players from the great players. When a play gets disrupted or breaks down completely the best players can take over by creating off the dribble for themselves or their teammates. Pierce has this ability. Wade has it. Kobe. Lebron. Anthony. OKC has a player who can do this but his name isn't Durant. Westbrook can create and does all the time but the problem is he does have a tendency to create only for himself. If Durant wants to truly become an elite player he must work on his ball handling and his strength. He is definitely not unguardable and the best teams have players on their rosters who can stop him.

I do agree with you on his demeanor. However Durant is a wing player and the best wing players in the NBA (or at any level) are able to consistently create their own shots and not rely on the point guard to feed them. Wing players aren't like post players (Karl Malone, Dwight Howard, Shaquille O'Neal, Moses Malone, etc...) who should rely on the point guard to set them up and get them the ball. Again, Durant's game is Reggie Miller like as opposed to Jordan like. Nothing wrong with being like Reggie Miller. Miller scored a lot and had success. But the knock on him was he couldn't create his own shot (unlike Jordan of course) and therefore he was easier to guard and easier to take out of the game and become a non-factor. We'll see if Memphis and Battier can make Durant a non-factor again on Sunday.
post #3233 of 27247
Any comments or predictions on the Bulls/Heat series? Seems like almost anything is possible in this one. I've seen predictions of Bulls in 5, 6 and 7, and the same for the Heat. I wouldn't disagree with any of them.
post #3234 of 27247
it would be nice to see the Heat gel and really stick it to the bulls in 5games. because then it really shows that they are all on the same page and working it out as a team up to their potential.

but it would be equally fun to see the Heat lose and have lebron/wade/bosh all start bickering/faltering and being pushed around by boozer/noah with rose torching the shit out of whomever is trying to mark him.

I have a feeling Rose might torch the Heat for two games by himself... but it might not be enough... Heat in 6.
post #3235 of 27247
Quote:
Originally Posted by WUKILLABEEZ78 View Post
He doesn't have the skills yet. He comes off screens and catches and shoots or catches and makes a quick move and shoots. How many times do you see OKC give him the ball in iso situations? How many times do they post him up? Every now and then he scores in situations like these (esp. if he has a advantage like if a big man or smaller player has been switched on him) but he is much more comfortable shooting jumpshots. A dedicated defender can stop him because they aren't going to let him go by them and they force him to what he wants to do except they do a great job contesting it. OKC pushed the Lakers in the playoffs last year not because of Durant (who shot a poor percentage and was taken out of his game by Artest) but because Westbrook shredded their defense over and over. You can't compare what Boston runs for Pierce and what Miami runs for Wade because both of them are very capable ball handlers who can create their own shots. They each are capable of getting a rebound and dribbling the ball down the court and creating for themselves or their teammates. If Pierce isn't getting the ball enough from Rondo he can get the ball and do his own thing. Durant has not shown the ability to do this. He needs help and gets the bulk of his scoring opportunities through the offensive scheme. This is what separates the very good players from the great players. When a play gets disrupted or breaks down completely the best players can take over by creating off the dribble for themselves or their teammates. Pierce has this ability. Wade has it. Kobe. Lebron. Anthony. OKC has a player who can do this but his name isn't Durant. Westbrook can create and does all the time but the problem is he does have a tendency to create only for himself. If Durant wants to truly become an elite player he must work on his ball handling and his strength. He is definitely not unguardable and the best teams have players on their rosters who can stop him. I do agree with you on his demeanor. However Durant is a wing player and the best wing players in the NBA (or at any level) are able to consistently create their own shots and not rely on the point guard to feed them. Wing players aren't like post players (Karl Malone, Dwight Howard, Shaquille O'Neal, Moses Malone, etc...) who should rely on the point guard to set them up and get them the ball. Again, Durant's game is Reggie Miller like as opposed to Jordan like. Nothing wrong with being like Reggie Miller. Miller scored a lot and had success. But the knock on him was he couldn't create his own shot (unlike Jordan of course) and therefore he was easier to guard and easier to take out of the game and become a non-factor. We'll see if Memphis and Battier can make Durant a non-factor again on Sunday.
All I'm saying is that OKC better find a way to get him the ball and it isn't really that hard to do so. We are nitpicking the game of a guy that's averaged almost 30 and was the scoring leader the last two seasons. If westbrook doesn't realize this he will lose game 7 and he might not get out of the stadium alive And Durant can create off the dribble. He'll get his shot off or get fouled and shoot 90+% from the stripe. The rest of the stuff you said I agree with.
post #3236 of 27247
Bulls/Heat Promo


Sunday night will be epic. Bulls in 6.
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post #3237 of 27247
Vegas has heat at about 2 to 1. I'm pulling for the heat and think they will win it, but it's a lot closer than 2 to 1. Just the regular season record should have you respecting the Bulls more than that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ambulance Chaser View Post
Nice analysis of Phil Jackson's career, by Celtics homer Bill Simmons of all people.
Great article. Left out the biggest proof of Phil's bad-assness. He gets to pork his boss's daughter regularly and get away with it
post #3238 of 27247
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRoi View Post
Vegas has heat at about 2 to 1. I'm pulling for the heat and think they will win it, but it's a lot closer than 2 to 1. Just the regular season record should have you respecting the Bulls more than that. Great article. Left out the biggest proof of Phil's bad-assness. He gets to pork his boss's daughter regularly and get away with it
great read. thanks
post #3239 of 27247
[quote=HRoi;4472766]Vegas has heat at about 2 to 1. I'm pulling for the heat and think they will win it, but it's a lot closer than 2 to 1. Just the regular season record should have you respecting the Bulls more than that.


I agree. I think it's pretty close to even. I'd probably put the Bulls as a slight underdog, even though I'd really like to see them win it.
post #3240 of 27247
The only 2 NBA players I truly dislike are LeBron and Noah, so it's tough picking a winner there. That said, that promo vid really reminded me of how much LeBron irritates me, and he has the annoying Bosh on his team as well, so I guess I'll hope for Chicago to win and then get beat by whoever comes out of the West.
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