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NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread - Page 1655

post #24811 of 27359
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve B. View Post

LOL

Edit: I don't know about AD. He's as fragile as a china doll.

Did you post this before or after he was ruled out for the season?
post #24812 of 27359
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post

Did you post this before or after he was ruled out for the season?

Before. And he's the centerpiece of one of my first place fantasy teams, along with Pau Gasol.
post #24813 of 27359
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve B. View Post


11-25 with 12 boards is lousy?

 

Well, maybe this is just because I'm a Blazers fan and have seen what he's capable of, but those counting stats look a lot better than his play did (on O at least). He missed a bunch of gimmes and had some very weak sauce turnovers in the post, and 26 points on 25 shots isn't particularly strong for a stud All-Star big man, even one whose bread and butter is the pick & pop.

post #24814 of 27359
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRoi View Post

I've got

1. Curry
2. Lebron
3. A Davis
4. Kawhi
5. Durant
6. Westbrook
7. Paul
8. Harden
9. Wall
10. Tough one between Boogie and Butler. Let's go Boogie because a great center is a much rarer commodity

If I were picking for a team I would manage, AD zooms to the top of my list because of his potential. And Harden and Boogie drop off because of shit defense and attitude, respectively

 

Wow--I know some people overrate him, but I'm still shocked you'd put Wall, Boogie, and Butler all ahead of Lillard. And I love Boogie and Butler, even.

post #24815 of 27359
Not meant to be a slam on Dame, it's just hard to pick 10. Cousins has a rarer and more valuable position, and I like the way Wall and Butler play D a bit more
post #24816 of 27359

Wall has been carrying the Wiz all season. His shooting is still sub-par but apart from that he's aces; if he didn't need to run the team as much as he does he'd be a Top 3 PG defender, easily. Maybe Beal will stay healthy and Keef will keep out of trouble, a locked-in, defense-oriented Wall is a sight to behold.

post #24817 of 27359
I like KAT more than cousins
post #24818 of 27359
Quote:
Originally Posted by phoni View Post
 

His shooting is still sub-par but apart from that he's aces

 

Diff of opinion, maybe, but I really believe that shooting is the master skill in the NBA these days. Teams that can't shoot are solvable by a good defense; teams that can shoot can beat anyone on any given day. Right now, I believe NBA offenses need four solid shooters on the floor at any given time. You can get by with three, but two? Not in today's Association.

 

With that in mind, Wall, imo, has hit his peak. He's worked hard at it, and he's improved, but he's just not a good shooter. So while he's not MCW/Rondo/Rubio level atrocious from deep, he's closer to them than to the opposing Curry/Dame/Russell pole. Teams pack the paint, dare him to shoot, and he can't punish them for doing so.

post #24819 of 27359
for HROI



yoAx2YD.jpg
post #24820 of 27359
icon_gu_b_slayer[1].gif

Pretty surprised with how well they've done after Bosh went down, honestly. We all know about Whiteside, but getting Joe J (no longer iso Joe!) and this Richardson kid seems to have been a coup.

I do see them cooling off and being hard pressed to advance past the second round, but it's a lot better performance than expected
post #24821 of 27359
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvin100 View Post
 

With that in mind, Wall, imo, has hit his peak. He's worked hard at it, and he's improved, but he's just not a good shooter. So while he's not MCW/Rondo/Rubio level atrocious from deep, he's closer to them than to the opposing Curry/Dame/Russell pole. Teams pack the paint, dare him to shoot, and he can't punish them for doing so.


Yeah, that's false optics. I'm not surprised, since Wall is operating in a small market and hardly ever does he gets his games shown on national TV.

 

For the season, Wall is at 34.7% from 3 and 45.4% inside the arc. Curry is in a class of his own so anyone compared to him will look bad.

 

Westbrook? 50% inside the arc, but only 30.7% from 3. The much-heralded Lillard? 37.9% from 3 and 46.1% inside the arc. That's 3% better than Wall on 3 pointers. Sure, Wall takes 4 attempts per game and Lillard takes 8. Sure, Lillard may shoot a lot better with defenders near him, but overall shooting is not Wall's weakness; the issue is that it's also not his strength.

 

For the season, Wall is better than Kyrie from 3, and he's got almost the same % as Isaiah Thomas. MCW was shooting 27.3% from deep this year, which is brutal; Rubio and Rondo are doing OK, relatively, at 32.1% and 34.4%, respectively. They do take just 2 attempts per game, so that's half as much as Wall. 

 

Based on reputation, your assessment is spot on, but based on numbers Wall is definitely capable. Our roster has been hit by injuries all season so I'm curious to see how this final stretch will go, now that most people are back and we have a clear upgrade at the 4 with Keef. Looking at the Atlanta game performance, we might be coming in hot for the playoffs.

post #24822 of 27359
Hornets finally respectable again after like 20 years. Not sure if MKG eventually fits back on the floor with Batum.
post #24823 of 27359
Yeah, I guess that's fair, but a few counterpoints nonetheless - just last year, Wall shot .300 from deep and his eFG% and TS% are actually a tick lower than last year (and a lot lower than Lillard's). I'd argue that Lillard has carried Portland more than Wall has Washington, but that's debatable at least, and they're comparable in WAR and VORP this year. I also admit that I've only seen 5-6 Wiz games this year, but in each one, defenses have collapsed on Wall, fucking up the otherwise excellent Wall-Hammer p&r action. Might not have been representative, of course, so I'll defer to you on that one.
 
Originally Posted by phoni View Post
 


Yeah, that's false optics. 


Edited by marvin100 - 3/22/16 at 8:30pm
post #24824 of 27359

I will also admit that I haven't seen many Blazers games so not sure what your roster has been like. I know LMA left a huge hole and I think your number 2 guy was injured for a bit, so it might be that Lillard has had as heavy a load, or heavier, as Wall.

 

Good looking with the advanced stats; without Beal on the court defenses tend to disregard our other perimeter players, so it's true - Wall has a lot less space to operate. This is why Keef is a game changer for us, as long as he can keep his 3 pointers to mid-30%; Dudley can stretch the floor but he's not as good defensively (one on one at least).

post #24825 of 27359
Quote:
Originally Posted by phoni View Post
 

I will also admit that I haven't seen many Blazers games so not sure what your roster has been like. I know LMA left a huge hole and I think your number 2 guy was injured for a bit, so it might be that Lillard has had as heavy a load, or heavier, as Wall.

 

Good looking with the advanced stats; without Beal on the court defenses tend to disregard our other perimeter players, so it's true - Wall has a lot less space to operate. This is why Keef is a game changer for us, as long as he can keep his 3 pointers to mid-30%; Dudley can stretch the floor but he's not as good defensively (one on one at least).

 

Blazers lost four starters--Mathews, Batum, Lopez, and Aldridge--and replaced them with cast-offs (Mason Plumlee, Aminu, Noah Vonleh) and the now-great CJ McCollum. Portland's bench features a fearsome menagerie as well: Mo Harkless (cast-off--can shoot), Meyers Leonard (oof--but he can shoot!), Allen Crabbe (remember when I said shooting is the master skill? That's all this guy can do, and it's enough to make him alarmingly useful), Gerald Henderson (cast-off--can sometimes shoot), Ed Davis (cast-off), Brian Roberts (cast-off--can shoot), and--wait for it--the stain left behind by the decomposed corpse of Chris Kaman.

 

Jared Dudley is the kind of player I'm talking about, honestly. He's smart and knows his role, but he'd be completely useless if he weren't a very, very good shooter from range. He lacks quickness on D and has no athletic prowess to speak of, but in today's game, floor spreaders who can tread water on the other end are extremely valuable. Keef can be good, but you never know when he's going to get arrested for beating the shit out of a former mentor...

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