or Connect
Styleforum › Forums › Culture › Entertainment, Culture, and Sports › NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread - Page 1378

post #20656 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brothersport View Post

what these players need to realize is that it's a privilege to play in the nba. these millenials are complaining about getting 9,000,000 dollars a year for playing a child's game while hard-working americans are working to pull themselves up by their own bootstraps. just another symptom of the take-take-take welfare society created by the wussification of america. if these players aren't happy then they should take a hike. any regular american would be glad to take their jobs.

^I know that was satire post, but maybe you can convince Bruce Springsteen or maybe John Cougar Mellencamp to make this a verse in one of their upcoming songs?
post #20657 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by LawrenceMD View Post

^I know that was satire post, but maybe you can convince Bruce Springsteen or maybe John Cougar Mellencamp to make this a verse in one of their upcoming songs?

This is NBA, make it a rap lyric.
post #20658 of 27236
Oh, he thought it was a serious post...crazy.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by idfnl View Post

Focused on how overpaying is so pervasive, and so many bad contracts exist. You think 7.5 mil is an amazing deal? Ok then, so you never answered... what do you think he's worth?

Your definition of overpaid is so ridiculously arbitrary.  The cap is currently around $68 million.  It's projected to skyrocket to roughly $90 mil once the new TV deal kicks in.  $7.5 mil now takes up a bigger portion of the cap than $7.5 in 2 years or so.  It's not a hard concept to grasp.  Contracts that are viewed as bad right now (and I mean contracts that are actually bad and not idfnl's "he's getting paid a cent over the league minimum so it's bad" definition of bad) will not be nearly as terrible once the cap rises Just because Dragic will get paid more than 8 or 9 mil a year does not make his deal a bad one unless gets into a bar fight and cuts his eye or some shit (not even sure how you came up with that number or why it's so significant to you if he gets paid more than that...).
Edited by diadem - 2/20/15 at 8:36pm
post #20659 of 27236
Looks like it's gonna be one of those nights....


lyMoK.gif
post #20660 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by idfnl View Post

This is NBA, make it a rap lyric.

quoted for the way you mimic ESPN Talking Heads' talent for race-baiting tongue.gif

I'm impressed! really that was awesome.
post #20661 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by diadem View Post

What's sad is that idfnl thought it was a serious post. facepalm.gif

My response was a very serious post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diadem View Post

Your definition of overpaid is so ridiculously arbitrary. The cap is currently around $68 million. It's projected to skyrocket to roughly $90 mil once the new TV deal kicks in. $7.5 mil now takes up a bigger portion of the cap than $7.5 in 2 years or so. It's not a hard concept to grasp. Contracts that are viewed as bad right now (and I mean contracts that actually bad and not idfnl's "he's getting paid a cent over the league minimum so it's bad" definition of bad) will not be nearly as terrible once the cap rises. Just because Dragic will get paid more than 8 or 9 mil a year does not make his deal a bad one unless gets into a bar fight and cuts his eye or some shit (not even sure how you came up with that number or why it's so significant to you if he gets paid more than that...).

If it's not arbitrary, it's kelly blue book/carfax. Wish you clowns would decide. "Cap is going to rise" reminds me of idiots that spend their work bonuses before they ever get them. Again, there is a reason Simmons writes a yearly column on it.
post #20662 of 27236
Lol I said you had your own Kelley Blue Book on players, which IS arbitrary...as in you're writing your own damn book on player values. You really do have a knack for taking what people say way out of context.

And the TV deal is set in stone. There's no question that the cap will rise -- it's the exact dollar amount it will rise by that is up in the air. The issue is you can't just wait to find out if you're trying to lock a player into a favorable long term deal. Oh, but your powers of hindsight will show us in 5 years the blunder of the Heat front office's ways...
Edited by diadem - 2/20/15 at 9:05pm
post #20663 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by diadem View Post

Lol I said you had your own Kelley Blue Book on players, which IS arbitrary...as in you're writing your own damn book on player values. You really do have a knack for taking what people say way out of context.

When people start talking like this, it usually means they are a step or two from being made to look stupid. I recommend you stop. Take the fact that the Kelly Blue Book exists to counter arbitrary prices as a hint, bro.

I put my views on Dragic out there. Lots of whingers here who love the dog and pony show, but never put a number to a player. I know, it's the new salary cap.
post #20664 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by idfnl View Post

I put my views on Dragic out there. Lots of whingers here who love the dog and pony show, but never put a number to a player. I know, it's the new salary cap.


ok I've put a some rough calculations into this, it involves what the current cap % max players have this year and the potential increased salary cap, maybe roughly $89 million...

its kind of long so here goes:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
post #20665 of 27236
Don't forget there is a team minimum salary of 90% of the salary cap. $9M for Dragic would equate to 10% of the cap in a few years which seems pretty reasonable to me for any starter, let alone a top 5 player at his position (even top 10). IDFNL you clearly lack an understanding of the market for talent in the NBA.

The reason Simmons has fodder for those columns is because NBA players have guaranteed contracts. The same is true in baseball - see Zito, Barry. The same would be true in football but those players just get cut. This is also nothing new in the NBA - I remember reading about Hot Rod Williams terrible contract in the mid 90's. Just looked it up and he got $26.5M over 5 years in 1990!

The way NBA teams make it work is by having a few guys on rookie contracts and a few "overpaid" free agents or 2nd or 3rd contract guys. The best GMs are the guys who figure out ways to get the top players to sign with them that everyone knows is a max player (eg Pat Riley), or get guys to take less money (Spurs) or get guys who are under the radar and coach them up (Spurs, Heat). It's a small league and by and large everyone can figure out who the top players are. The salaries don't reflect how good these top guys are. Harden is a great example - you wouldn't have given him a max, but the truth is he's worth more than a max. The Warriors are doing great this season because they have a couple of guys who are max (or close to max) players who are making considerably less money. Ditto for the Hawks. It's really hard to keep teams like that together so other teams will max them out if the original team can't or won't - see OKC losing harden.

I know I'm either preaching to the converted or to those incapable of understanding but I had a few minutes during the Warriors Spurs game so what the heck. On that note, Go W's! Starting to pull away in the 3rd quarter.
post #20666 of 27236
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by idfnl View Post

When people start talking like this, it usually means they are a step or two from being made to look stupid. I recommend you stop. Take the fact that the Kelly Blue Book exists to counter arbitrary prices as a hint, bro.


I put my views on Dragic out there. Lots of whingers here who love the dog and pony show, but never put a number to a player. I know, it's the new salary cap.


That's still a step or 2 ahead of you.  Notice how there's no real-life example for everything that you're arguing for -- the strategy of penny-pinching, being stingy with picks, all that crap (except maybe the Sixers, but they just took on JaVale McGee's ALBATROSS of a contract and YOU HATE TANKING).  The league has been around for over 50 years...don't you think if your strategy was so great, there would be a dynasty built upon it by now? And yes, the Spurs were over the cap when they won in 2003 and 2007.

And I already put a price on Dragic -- a max deal, that is if MIA wants to keep him because there are plenty of other teams willing to sign him to one.  That's projected to be 5 years and close to $100 million, by the way, so there's your number.
post #20667 of 27236
warriors are soooo good. they're just everywhere on D and constantly getting open 3s on offense.
post #20668 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnFacconable View Post

Don't forget there is a team minimum salary of 90% of the salary cap. $9M for Dragic would equate to 10% of the cap in a few years which seems pretty reasonable to me for any starter, let alone a top 5 player at his position (even top 10). IDFNL you clearly lack an understanding of the market for talent in the NBA.

The reason Simmons has fodder for those columns is because NBA players have guaranteed contracts. The same is true in baseball - see Zito, Barry. The same would be true in football but those players just get cut. This is also nothing new in the NBA - I remember reading about Hot Rod Williams terrible contract in the mid 90's. Just looked it up and he got $26.5M over 5 years in 1990!

This is about risk, not talent. A player's body often breaks down before talent is realized, or the player indulges in too much distraction.

Is Dragic worth 12m next year? Sure. For that year. In 5, when he's 33? Maybe, but unlikely. It's too much risk in a guaranteed contract world, so you price it in. Simmons has fodder for those columns because too many shit contracts exist. Being guaranteed just exposes it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by diadem View Post

Quote:
Notice how there's no real-life example for everything that you're arguing for -- the strategy of penny-pinching, being stingy with picks, all that crap

And I already put a price on Dragic -- a max deal, that is if MIA wants to keep him because there are plenty of other teams willing to sign him to one. That's projected to be 5 years and close to $100 million, by the way, so there's your number.

I put forward what I think Leonard and Dragic are worth, those are real life examples. I chuckle at the idea it's penny pinching, it's risk assessment. Dragic is never a max guy, not even close. And to justify it because other teams are willing to pay? Let them pay. At that level, he'll almost certainly be fodder for the Simmons column or an expiring trade chip.

Regarding picks, just don't trade them.
post #20669 of 27236
Right, just let him walk after giving up 2 first-round draft picks and 4 rotation players for him...facepalm.
post #20670 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by diadem View Post

Right, just let him walk after giving up 2 first-round draft picks and 4 rotation players for him...facepalm.

My point exactly about not giving up draft picks. They overpaid to get a 16 and 4 guy, and will overpay again, compounding the mistake.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
Styleforum › Forums › Culture › Entertainment, Culture, and Sports › NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread