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NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread - Page 1280

post #19186 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by LawrenceMD View Post

relegation isn't going to create more parity. of course tanking sucks. but thats the system... its the way the Lakers got Magic and Kobe, the Bulls got Jordan, spurs got Duncan and the Celtics got Bird. There's already onus by the league to change it though. It'll happen eventually.
don't want to extend this argument any further, but in fact, lakers had a 53-29 record the year before the traded for kobe rights and they had a winning record before signing shaq as a free agent. the spurs had the third-worst record after injuries to robinson and sean elliot.
post #19187 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post

don't want to extend this argument any further, but in fact, lakers had a 53-29 record the year before the traded for kobe rights and they had a winning record before signing shaq as a free agent. the spurs had the third-worst record after injuries to robinson and sean elliot.

Same is true with respect to Magic, no? The Jabbar-Nixon-Wilkes Lakers might not have won any championships, but they weren't terrible, either. And more to the point, the Magic pick came to the Lakers from Utah for Gail Goodrich.
post #19188 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFX45 View Post

MJ punched him in the face?

And Will Perdue!
post #19189 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post

Same is true with respect to Magic, no? The Jabbar-Nixon-Wilkes Lakers might not have won any championships, but they weren't terrible, either. And more to the point, the Magic pick came to the Lakers from Utah for Gail Goodrich.
yup. they drafted magic with a choice they'd gotten from new orleans in compensation for gail goodrich.
to get kobe, they traded vlade divac
post #19190 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post


to get kobe, they traded vlade divac

Thereby cutting off the possibility of a historic Divac-Van Exel dynasty. Oh, what could have been . . .
post #19191 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post

Thereby cutting off the possibility of a historic Divac-Van Exel dynasty. Oh, what could have been . . .
yes, but setting up a decade of highly entertaining divac-o'neal face-offs!
post #19192 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post

yup. they drafted magic with a choice they'd gotten from new orleans in compensation for gail goodrich.
to get kobe, they traded vlade divac

Jerry West knew what he had in getting kobe. Its kind of sad that other teams didn't realize it too. Remember the 2003 Lebron Draft? Jerry was sitting there either getting the top pick or nothing and ended up with nothing in that loaded assed top heavy draft (wade/lebron/bosh/carmelo) as GM/President of Memphis.

Jerry West seemed like an excellent evaluator of talent. I wonder why he left the lakers front office.
post #19193 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by LawrenceMD View Post

Jerry West knew what he had in getting kobe. Its kind of sad that other teams didn't realize it too. Remember the 2003 Lebron Draft? Jerry was sitting there either getting the top pick or nothing and ended up with nothing in that loaded assed top heavy draft (wade/lebron/bosh/carmelo).
what do you mean? he got brian cook and luke walton! icon_gu_b_slayer[1].gif
seriously, it was a superstar draft, but the lakers had a great record and there wasn't that much left by the time they picked. a few retrospective picks -- who knew josh howard would end up being a player, or steve blake, or barbosa -- but nothing that really leapt out at you. at least he didn't trade kobe for rights to dark milich
Quote:
Jerry West seemed like an excellent evaluator of talent. I wonder why he left the lakers front office.
he's a really fascinating guy. one of the more complicated characters i've ever been around. he left because he didn't think he could handle basketball anymore. he would get so anxious that he would throw up before regular season games -- and that's as a gm with like 30 years on top of the game. but once he left, he couldn't stay away. i really think he's one of those guys who has one thing in their lives -- and, unfortunately, that seems to include his family; he hates the game -- or what it does to him -- but he is nothing without it.
post #19194 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFX45 View Post

I'd be very interested to see if GSW is capable of beating the Bulls record though it seems highly doubtful they finish with 7 losses the whole season.

I love my W's and they're playing great so far, but I would be shocked if they win 60 games. They've been extremely lucky in a number of ways I wouldn't expect to continue. First, they've managed to play quite a few games against teams who's best players were sitting the game out (Rockets, Pelicans and others - I think Swaggy P was out for the Lakers beat down nod[1].gif).

Second, even when they've played poorly they've managed to pull it together at the end of the game and win. Sure they get credit for that, but I wouldn't expect it to happen so frequently.

Third - they can't beat the spurs and probably can't beat the grizzlies. Also the Rockets and Clippers will get at least a couple of wins between them, so that's like 7 or 8 losses right there. As bad as the East is, the W's won't go undefeated against the conference. I'm still nervous about playing the Knicks, because Edmorel kept talking about how good they were going to be once they put it all together (sorry Ed, couldn't resist the cheap shot).

Fourth - everyone on the team except Iguodala is having a career year. Iggy may play better, but he may not. Speights will come down to earth as will Harrison Barnes. Will be interesting to see how they integrate David Lee when he's back.

Fifth and most critical - health. Other than Lee being out, they've been healthy all season. Bogut is nursing an injury now and who knows whether he'll make it through the season. I won't even talk about Steph's ankles. Health is probably my biggest playoff concern because it's been a contributor to the derailment of the last few playoff runs.
post #19195 of 27340
Well, Steve Kerr doesn't think they can win 72.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/12029115/golden-state-warriors-coach-steve-kerr-says-no-way-team-matches-chicago-bulls-72-win-season
post #19196 of 27340
I'd enjoy it if the Warriors grab the top seed and the Mavs or Thunder ended up with the 8 seed stirpot.gif
post #19197 of 27340
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnFacconable View Post

I love my W's and they're playing great so far, but I would be shocked if they win 60 games. They've been extremely lucky in a number of ways I wouldn't expect to continue. First, they've managed to play quite a few games against teams who's best players were sitting the game out (Rockets, Pelicans and others - I think Swaggy P was out for the Lakers beat down nod[1].gif).

Second, even when they've played poorly they've managed to pull it together at the end of the game and win. Sure they get credit for that, but I wouldn't expect it to happen so frequently.

Third - they can't beat the spurs and probably can't beat the grizzlies. Also the Rockets and Clippers will get at least a couple of wins between them, so that's like 7 or 8 losses right there. As bad as the East is, the W's won't go undefeated against the conference. I'm still nervous about playing the Knicks, because Edmorel kept talking about how good they were going to be once they put it all together (sorry Ed, couldn't resist the cheap shot).

Fourth - everyone on the team except Iguodala is having a career year. Iggy may play better, but he may not. Speights will come down to earth as will Harrison Barnes. Will be interesting to see how they integrate David Lee when he's back.

Fifth and most critical - health. Other than Lee being out, they've been healthy all season. Bogut is nursing an injury now and who knows whether he'll make it through the season. I won't even talk about Steph's ankles. Health is probably my biggest playoff concern because it's been a contributor to the derailment of the last few playoff runs.


Good assessment and you can probably add turnovers to that, I think they still have way too many of them, no?
post #19198 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by LawrenceMD View Post

what is the opinion. I gave links to EPL and La Liga champions history. its dominated by a select few rich clubs.

oh and the UEFA champions league winners:

LL

^more proof? its even more top heavy then some of the damn regular leagues. where's the parity in that?

come on man that as actual proof enough that the richest clubs who can afford the best players have the best chance of winning. just like having a superstar (or better yet two or more superstars) is going to put you in a better position to win a champion.

relegation isn't going to create more parity. of course tanking sucks. but thats the system... its the way the Lakers got Magic and Kobe, the Bulls got Jordan, spurs got Duncan and the Celtics got Bird. There's already onus by the league to change it though. It'll happen eventually.

Sure, European football is much more capitalist than the closed club the NBA is, so yeah, the richest clubs buy the best players. Just like in F1, the team that can spend the most is usually champion. Euro football has other things to achieve, though. There are usually 2 different domestic league cups to win. A real juggernaut wins the treble, the C League, the domestic league, and the domestic cup. There is simply a lot more to root for. With basketball they are all chasing the same chip.

In the end, all these spending caps, drafts, and jiggering to make the owners richer and you still only have a few teams every year that can win the title.
post #19199 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnFacconable View Post

shocked is a bit much, no? i think it's better than even odds they get 60. sure they've gotten a bit lucky, but that just means they're gonna fall off their 75 win (!!!) pace, not that they're gonna crash and burn. they just need to go 40-20 the rest of the year. bogut's already been out for a few and they've managed to win, lee will come back to bolster their bench. steph hasn't had an ankle issue that lasted more than 5 games for what, like 3 years?
post #19200 of 27340
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRoi View Post

I'd enjoy it if the Warriors grab the top seed and the Mavs or Thunder ended up with the 8 seed stirpot.gif

Wouldn't want to face the Thunder but the Mavs aren't scary. The teams that concern me are the Spurs, Grizzlies, Clippers and Rockets. Maybe the Trailblazers after that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFX45 View Post

Good assessment and you can probably add turnovers to that, I think they still have way too many of them, no?

Turnovers have certainly been a problem, but less so as the season has gone on. First seven games they were probably averaging 22 or 23 TOs per. They turned it over a bunch against the Pelicans but prior to that hadn't were averaging 13 or 14 I think during the winning streak which is about average for the league.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brothersport View Post

shocked is a bit much, no? i think it's better than even odds they get 60. sure they've gotten a bit lucky, but that just means they're gonna fall off their 75 win (!!!) pace, not that they're gonna crash and burn. they just need to go 40-20 the rest of the year. bogut's already been out for a few and they've managed to win, lee will come back to bolster their bench. steph hasn't had an ankle issue that lasted more than 5 games for what, like 3 years?

I don't think 57 or 58 wins would be considered as crashing and burning. That would mean they go 36-21 for the rest of the season (assuming loss tonight). Warriors aren't infallible and will struggle at times. Clippers had a 17 game win streak last year and won 57 games. I do agree if substantially the whole team continues to have career years, 60 games is more than doable.
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