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NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread - Page 1229

post #18421 of 27250
The battle between advanced stats dudes and traditionalists should be very interesting this year now that we've crossed the threshold and most teams are starting to get it. I happen to think it's a runaway freight train and dinosaurs like Kobe and Carmelo need to retire or adapt. I guess the third option is to lose.

It's particularly interesting to me for a few reasons - first because I follow the Warriors who now have a coach that appears to be paying attention to modern concepts and I think the roster was built with that in mind. Mark Jackson was a player's coach and great at motivating his players, but was terrible about maximizing his talent on offense and paying attention to which 5 man units worked and which didn't. Steve Kerr will do better. It's also interesting because I know some people inside the advanced analytics industry and get a lot of insight through that.
post #18422 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by UnFacconable View Post

The battle between advanced stats dudes and traditionalists should be very interesting this year now that we've crossed the threshold and most teams are starting to get it. I happen to think it's a runaway freight train and dinosaurs like Kobe and Carmelo need to retire or adapt. I guess the third option is to lose.
t.

I'm not even sure what that means. Kobe's going to lose because he's on a shitty team, not because he's on the wrong side of a battle between advanced stats dudes and traditionalists (That's a hilariously false, or at least exaggerated, dichotomy anyway. But those sorts of constructs can be enjoyable as long as you place yourself among the ranks of the enlightened knights of modernism). Probably true of Carmelo, too, but I haven't paid attention to the Knicks.
post #18423 of 27250
you won't be able to begin to tell whether the triangle is working or not until January at the earliest. it's hellishly complicated to run right, where almost every player has 2 or 3 options to read and react and the other 4 players have to feel the offense enough to be able to read or react to what they're doing. when it's run well (which even the lakers did only sporadically), it's almost indefensible. it's kind of like when oklahoma introduced the wishbone option ... you can't take everything away so you end up taking nothing away. but for the players, it has to become almost second nature for it to work well.
post #18424 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post

I'm not even sure what that means. Kobe's going to lose because he's on a shitty team, not because he's on the wrong side of a battle between advanced stats dudes and traditionalists (That's a hilariously false, or at least exaggerated, dichotomy anyway. But those sorts of constructs can be enjoyable as long as you place yourself among the ranks of the enlightened knights of modernism). Probably true of Carmelo, too, but I haven't paid attention to the Knicks.
see, you just don't understand statistics. because the stats determine whether the shot will go in or not, not whether they did... nod[1].gif
post #18425 of 27250
Thread Starter 
post-25810-nevermind-gif-it-crowd-imgur-yvca.gif
Edited by RFX45 - 10/31/14 at 3:11pm
post #18426 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post

see, you just don't understand statistics. because the stats determine whether the shot will go in or not, not whether they did... nod[1].gif

When I was a kid I had a baseball simulation game on my Apple II+ that basically extrapolated from statistics the way Strat-O-Matic baseball or (in cruder or at least more spatial form) the old All Star Baseball game with cardboard discs did. It included players from a number of classic World Series teams. One of my favorite players was Matt Alexander from the 1979 Pirates. In 44 games, he batted .538 with a .692 slugging percentage (in 13 at bats), scored 16 runs, and stole 13 bases.
post #18427 of 27250
Yikes. Not even Indeserturms stats talk can extinguish this Kawhi mess. I blame Kendrick Perkins.
post #18428 of 27250
Thread Starter 
lol8[1].gif

I didn't even know Kawhi stirred so much feeling among people here. Seriously it's like Kobe all of a sudden got a hold of yall butts like you were some white chick in Colorado.


I don't think he is max contract worthy, you guys do. It really should have ended there.
post #18429 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post

you won't be able to begin to tell whether the triangle is working or not until January at the earliest. it's hellishly complicated to run right, where almost every player has 2 or 3 options to read and react and the other 4 players have to feel the offense enough to be able to read or react to what they're doing. when it's run well (which even the lakers did only sporadically), it's almost indefensible. it's kind of like when oklahoma introduced the wishbone option ... you can't take everything away so you end up taking nothing away. but for the players, it has to become almost second nature for it to work well.

Well it's not whether the triangle works or not, it definitely works, it's how well the Knicks team take to the implementation of it. The pieces are there in terms of players but it's a system that requires all 5 players thinking 1-2 plays ahead and that takes a lot of time/experience to master and run it cohesively. There will be some awful games but if the players put the time in, it's a beautiful thing to watch
post #18430 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFX45 View Post

lol8[1].gif

I didn't even know Kawhi stirred so much feeling among people here. Seriously it's like Kobe all of a sudden got a hold of yall butts like you were some white chick in Colorado.


I don't think he is max contract worthy, you guys do. It really should have ended there.

Next you're going to be complaining about the fact check police.
post #18431 of 27250
Wait, hold up. The Fact Check Police or the Fact Check Mafia? And is it similar to the Miami Mafia that Jalen Rose is always blabbering about?
post #18432 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo_Version 7 View Post

Wait, hold up. The Fact Check Police or the Fact Check Mafia?

Stop nit-picking, if my opinion is that they should be referred to as the Fact Check Police, you have no business telling me otherwise.



Buy yeah, that. Good catch - thanks.
post #18433 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post

When I was a kid I had a baseball simulation game on my Apple II+ that basically extrapolated from statistics the way Strat-O-Matic baseball or (in cruder or at least more spatial form) the old All Star Baseball game with cardboard discs did. It included players from a number of classic World Series teams. One of my favorite players was Matt Alexander from the 1979 Pirates. In 44 games, he batted .538 with a .692 slugging percentage (in 13 at bats), scored 16 runs, and stole 13 bases.
wait, you had an apple II when you were a kid? I thought you were a grown man? I rolled old school: strat-o-matic baseball and vince lombardi football (dice games). i did have a basketball game, too, but i don't remember when one. didn't work terribly well. the beauty of basketball is not in percentages (paraphrasing jr smith).
post #18434 of 27250
Thread Starter 
post #18435 of 27250
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post

wait, you had an apple II when you were a kid? I thought you were a grown man? I rolled old school: strat-o-matic baseball and vince lombardi football (dice games). i did have a basketball game, too, but i don't remember when one. didn't work terribly well. the beauty of basketball is not in percentages (paraphrasing jr smith).

Just not as grown as you. fight[1].gif Apple II was middle school-ish.

I also had this lame football game (I thought it was cool then) where you had transparencies with offensive and defensive plays diagrammed with X's and O's. Each player chose his play, and you'd lay the two transparencies on top of a light box thing (like a cheapo-version of the base of an old overhead projector). I think where the ball carrier's dotted line crossed a defender's dotted line determined how many yards were gained on the play.

Of course, the fact that we had to keep pouring kerosene into the projector to keep the lamp burning made it pain in the ass to play.
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