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NBA 2016-2017 Season Thread - Page 1084

post #16246 of 27236
For the record I think LBJ is probably the best player in the game and don't hate him. But I don't find his game fun to watch (relative to the awesome athleticism that is the NBA).

My favorite player, as a spectator, was Jason Kidd. Jason Kidd. Jason Kidd.

Because Jason Kidd speaks for the revolution.
post #16247 of 27236
re: athleticism and w/e, that wasn't really what I was saying. I think natural athleticism is pretty damn innate, some exceptions provided.
i think there is also natural genetics heavily involved in hand-eye coordination (so dribbling, footwork) and shooting. practice helps w/ that as well.

all i was saying was that i think lebron doesn't have way more unfairly innate talents compared to kevin durant or curry. durant's and curry's shooting ability can't be attained w/o world-level natural talent, just like lebron's body.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post

You're saying that there's not a lot of kobe-hate out there? Or am I misreading your comment?
i think there's wayyyyy more irrational lebron hate than kobe hate, do you disagree?

there's also more irrational kobe love, even from other players. i get that, since lakers have more fans than anyone else. but there's tons of lbj hate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post

For the record I think LBJ is probably the best player in the game and don't hate him. But I don't find his game fun to watch (relative to the awesome athleticism that is the NBA).

My favorite player, as a spectator, was Jason Kidd. Jason Kidd. Jason Kidd.

Because Jason Kidd speaks for the revolution.
that's cool. your comment makes me think of this:
post #16248 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brothersport View Post


all i was saying was that i think lebron doesn't have way more unfairly innate talents compared to kevin durant or curry. durant's and curry's shooting ability can't be attained w/o world-level natural talent, just like lebron's body.
i think there's wayyyyy more irrational lebron hate than kobe hate, do you disagree?

there's also more irrational kobe love, even from other players. i get that, since lakers have more fans than anyone else. but there's tons of lbj hate.

No, I don't. Some of that may be a function of the fact that LBJ's a lot more relevant right now. But I'd agree with you regardless.

That's especially true when you are specifically taking about irrational hatred. Some percentage of kobe-hate stems from the rape allegations, and it's certainly not irrational for some people to hate him based on what they believe happened there.
post #16249 of 27236
i don't know if i'm ethically right in this regard but i don't even think about the rape case when i consider kobe. and i'm not even really a kobe fan. i wonder what % of ppl that applies to.
post #16250 of 27236
Brothersport: You know the video I meant, right? You have to hear my daughter deliver it at the dinner table.
I think KRS One, while 100% undermining the meaning of the original, did a great job of capturing its feel. The original Gil Scott Heron version made for a good history lesson for my daughter (and me), too, and with the internet's help, went through it line by line. A couple of guys here are probably old enough not to need the internet to teach them but too old to remember without it.

And Jason Williams =|= Jason Kidd. Though he does have a good highlight reel.
post #16251 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brothersport View Post

i don't know if i'm ethically right in this regard but i don't even think about the rape case when i consider kobe. and i'm not even really a kobe fan. i wonder what % of ppl that applies to.

I was thinking primarily about your comment that there are LBJ-haters who aren't even NBA fans. I think Kobe gets (or got) some of that, in part for that reason.

I'm sure it's less true now than back when the incident and the fall-out were recent and all over the media.
post #16252 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post

Brothersport: You know the video I meant, right? You have to hear my daughter deliver it at the dinner table.
I think KRS One, while 100% undermining the meaning of the original, did a great job of capturing its feel. The original Gil Scott Heron version made for a good history lesson for my daughter (and me), too, and with the internet's help, went through it line by line. A couple of guys here are probably old enough not to need the internet to teach them but too old to remember without it.

And Jason Williams =|= Jason Kidd. Though he does have a good highlight reel.
i dont know the video you meant shog[1].gif would love to hear the explanation.

yea i know white chocolate is different.
post #16253 of 27236
Using an iPhone so can't post it. Search for Nike ad Jason kidd revolution. Also, when you have time, look up Gil Scott herons "the revolution will not be televised".
post #16254 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRoi View Post

But the other point I wanted to make was there are some people who just collect haters. Some of these Lebron haters don't even support a basketball team

Its not just haters, its also wanting to see an underdog win. Dallas over Mia was very satisfying because you had an older Dirk and J Kidd out play the more talented team.

In other instances, I like Durant, and he's in his prime, but he just doesn't evoke that same bitch face attitude Lebron does. I just can't find a reason to hate him. Now Chris Paul, same shit, there's a guy that drives you crazy watching him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post

You're saying that there's not a lot of kobe-hate out there? Or am I misreading your comment?

I used to hate on Kobe but I have a soft spot for players past their prime. It's why I like Garnett so much, and the same thing happened when Jordan made his return to the Wizards. I used to hate on Michael Schumacher because he won every race for like 5 years strait, but when he made his comeback, I rather appreciated him.

Perhaps one day I may soften up to Lebron, especially if he returns to Cleveland with something in the tank, but otherwise, fuck him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post

My favorite player, as a spectator, was Jason Kidd. Jason Kidd. Jason Kidd.

Funny, Brothersport stole my thunder, but there was no player that I have ever enjoyed watching than Jason Williams in the Sac years. Olajuwon a close second and the 80s Lakers 3rd.
post #16255 of 27236
For me, I'll go with Steve Francis during his first stint with the Rockets. Stevey Franchise was just insane with his crossovers. He also had Russell Westbrook's athleticism and could dunk over anybody. He and Yao Ming were a great pairing during Ming's rookie year.
post #16256 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by indesertum View Post

athleticism is not more innate.... you have to work hard for it. you realize how much and how many times a week nba players have to work out? same thing with shooting. for example tony parker is not a naturally good shooter. he had some pretty terrible habits coming into the league. he had to work hard on it with a good coach.

I realize that ofc. But I disagree and say athleticism is more innate. Take Tony Parker; he trained hard and became a shooter somewhat comparable to Jose Calderon. No matter how many 100m dashes Calderon is gonna run he will never be a comparable athlete to Tony Parker. 32yr old and broken down by injuries Parker is still more explosive than 20yr old version of Jose Calderon, Steve Nash, Jamaal Tinsley, John Stockton etc etc
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post

i think to a certain extent it is. which is not to say that it cannot be improved upon. when i think of athleticism i think of the raw talent and then also the polish that it has been given. i think lebron is a great example of a raw talent who has been polished. i think kobe is a great example of a pretty ordinary talent who has been very polished (if you can say that about any nba player). he wasn't freakishly strong, didn't have an astonishing vertical jump, but he developed those things to the best that he could.

I will disagree with Kobe being ordinary talent. He is 6'6 and super explosive he is insanely gifted and also had like what 40 inch vertical when he was younger? It's just that compared to Shaq and LeBron he seems regular. Kobe had great athleticism. He developed skills to go with that.
post #16257 of 27236
Quote:
Originally Posted by dopey View Post

Using an iPhone so can't post it. Search for Nike ad Jason kidd revolution. Also, when you have time, look up Gil Scott herons "the revolution will not be televised".
smile.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by diadem View Post

For me, I'll go with Steve Francis during his first stint with the Rockets. Stevey Franchise was just insane with his crossovers. He also had Russell Westbrook's athleticism and could dunk over anybody. He and Yao Ming were a great pairing during Ming's rookie year.
cry.gif http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2014/5/6/5688350/steve-francis-drunk-in-love-champagne-shower
post #16258 of 27236
post #16259 of 27236
i think there was a watershed moment for lbj when he left cleveland, partly because of the way he left, partly because of the way he arrived in Miami, and partly because, well, hell, everybody hates the Yankees and those "store-bought" championships.
kobe stirred up a lot of animosity, partly because of the rape allegations, partly because people blamed him for breaking up the lakers, partly because he was top dog and everybody likes to hate the top dog. a lot of that has subsided as people have either forgotten about the allegations or dealt with them more rationally, and as kobe's physical skills have deteriorated. as hard as it may be to believe, i think he's now an underdog of a sort ... i don't know anyone who didn't seem him make those two free throws with a torn achilles, and then bust his ass to come back ahead of schedule, only to suffer another injury, who doesn't have some sympathy for him, if not outright admiration.
post #16260 of 27236
you are right that Kobe explosiveness is gone, he is avg athlete now.
Also I am no doctor but I knew Kobe and Rose will be hurt again and were not 100% healed, that was just dumb.
I like Kobe because he is immensely skilled, he is fun to watch. I liked Gasol more, he was the player with
superb potential imo and best center in the NBA 2009-2010 but he never had mentality like Kobe.
Kobe once called him Black Swan which was a bit funny, a bit insulting and a bit true sadly.
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