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NBA 2014-2015 Season Thread - Page 970

post #14536 of 18041
Quote:
Originally Posted by lawyerdad View Post

Going to the replay for fouls seems pretty disruptive. Maybe an NFL-style limited number of challenges?

 

something like this could be good, but games are long already so it should be a very limited no

post #14537 of 18041
Quote:
Originally Posted by wojt View Post

something like this could be good, but games are long already so it should be a very limited no

Completely agree.
post #14538 of 18041
i'm really divided on it. and no, i wasn't arguing that they woulda shoulda won except for the stinkin' refs. it was an honest question. as it is, i hate when the game comes to a complete stop so the refs can try to decide if the ball actually touched a player's fingertips. but i really think that if they're not going to provide some mechanism for remediation, they should probably just forget about announcing they made a mistake. it's bad enough when they downgrade flagrants, when it made a difference in a game.
post #14539 of 18041
The solution is to call less fouls across the board. Too many stoppages in modern games, and too many timeouts. But then the howling bitch faces would be all over the place like a certain superstar chopping his arm off in the tunnel after the white boy blocked his ass.

Ind - Atl tonight. I just have to watch this train wreck.
post #14540 of 18041
Quote:
Originally Posted by foodguy View Post
 but i really think that if they're not going to provide some mechanism for remediation, they should probably just forget about announcing they made a mistake.

 

agreed

post #14541 of 18041
Quote:
Originally Posted by idfnl View Post

The solution is to call less fouls across the board. Too many stoppages in modern games, and too many timeouts. But then the howling bitch faces would be all over the place like a certain superstar chopping his arm off in the tunnel after the white boy blocked his ass.
.

They do that shit because it works. They probably even know which refs are most susceptible to it. Even if they called fewer fouls, they'd still do it. Anything to get an edge.
post #14542 of 18041
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gibonius View Post

They do that shit because it works. They probably even know which refs are most susceptible to it. Even if they called fewer fouls, they'd still do it. Anything to get an edge.

I'd much rather see whining bitch faces for no calls than having all the phony contact rewarded. Speaking of this, Chris Paul needs to curb the exaggerations. That guy jiggles his head if someone breathes too heavy.
post #14543 of 18041
Thread Starter 
http://www.nba.com/lakers/news/140422skillball?cid=TW
Quote:
Skill Ball

It’s no secret the landscape of the NBA has changed.

Fewer teams employ traditional five-man lineups with a power forward and center. Rather, you will find a small forward or swingman playing a stretch-four alongside a power forward at the center position.

“When we started in Phoenix, they said you couldn’t win playing the way we wanted,” Lakers assistant coach Dan D’Antoni said. “We were the only team playing that way.”

Those Suns’ teams, where Dan was an assistant on his brother Mike's staff from 2003-08, often used Shawn Marion at the four and Amaré Stoudemire at the five, both players generally more athletic and quicker than most opponents they matched up against at their position.

With Steve Nash engineering high-powered offenses, those Phoenix teams tallied seasons of 62, 54, 61 and 55 wins. The furthest they advanced in the playoffs, though, was the Western Conference Finals.

Conventional thinking remained that teams needed a big man or big men to be championship contenders. The Lakers had Shaquille O’Neal during their “3-peat” run during the early 2000s; the Spurs had “Twin Towers” in David Robinson and Tim Duncan while winning three titles (1999, 2003, 2005); the Lakers had Andrew Bynum and Pau Gasol during back-to-back championships in 2009-10.

"Some of the hard part of coaching is to be able to drag people over to the next side,” Mike D'Antoni said at Lakers' exit interviews. “People are comfortable with doing business a certain way. When that business kind of shifts to get people to change, it’s not easy. It’s a process.”

Over the last two seasons, however, the Miami Heat have bucked that trend. Coach Erik Spoelstra used LeBron James, listed at 6-foot-8, 250 pounds, at the four, and Chris Bosh, at 6-foot-11, 235 pounds at the five, while traditionally playing smaller lineups centered around the versatility of James.

”Last year, you essentially had both teams – (Miami and San Antonio) – playing the same style that we had in Phoenix,” D’Antoni said. “Not only did (Miami) win once, but they won twice in a row. Obviously playing this way doesn’t inhibit you from being an NBA champion.”

During the 2013-14 season, a number of teams boasted more success employing smaller lineups.

Golden State’s top two lineups used David Lee at the five, with Draymond Green or Harrison Barnes at the four, plus Andre Iguodala, Klay Thompson and Stephen Curry. Their best combination of Curry, Thompson, Iguodala, Green and Lee boasted an offensive rating of 123.4 and a defensive rating of 89.2 – a net rating of 34.2.
*Net rating measures a team’s point differential per 100 possessions.

Even during the 2012-13 campaign, the Warriors frequently used a three-guard lineup of Curry, Jarrett Jack and Thompson, alongside Green and Lee towards an offensive rating of 105.1 and defensive rating of 89.5. Golden State has now appeared in the postseason in back-to-back years for the first time since the 1990-92 seasons.

San Antonio, who secured the best record in the league this year, were at their best this season with a smaller lineup featuring Tony Parker, Danny Green, Kawhi Leonard, Boris Diaw and Tim Duncan. In 104 minutes together, that five-man unit had an offensive rating of 112.6 and defensive rating of 85.3 for a net rating of 27.2. During their 2013 Finals run, the Spurs second-most used lineup featured Parker, Manu Ginobili, Leonard, Diaw and Duncan with a net rating of 6.8.

Despite a number of injuries and a constant shuffling of the starting lineup during the 2013-14 campaign, the Lakers played far better going “small” on the floor. Eight of their top 10 lineups featured a stretch four in either Ryan Kelly or Wesley Johnson, alongside one big man – either Pau Gasol or Chris Kaman. Their most-productive, most-used lineup consisted of Kendall Marshall, Jodie Meeks, Nick Young, Kelly and Gasol. In 71 minutes of floor time together, that unit boasted an offensive rating of 121.9 and a defensive rating of 120.0 – a rating of 1.9.

"Small ball” wasn’t just something Mike D'Antoni created overnight. Using these lineups also coincided with crucial rule changes the NBA has implemented over the years.

“It’s not something that one person came up with,” Lakers general manager Mitch Kupchak said. “It’s really based on the rules and the way the NBA is, I guess, how they feel the game should be played. The NBA just felt an open game, more up and down, more scoring and less physicality is a better game to watch.”

The league average for scoring during the 2000-01 season was 94.8, and only four teams averaged more than 100 points per game. In 2013-14, that figure increased to 101.1, and 17 teams topped the century mark on a per game basis. Teams played at a much faster pace and the three-point shot became much more valuable.

During the 2000-01 season, Boston led the league in three-point attempts with 1,633. In 2013-14, 20 teams attempted more than that amount, with the Houston Rockets leading the NBA with 2,179 attempts. In fact, seven teams attempted more than 2,000 three-pointers over the course of the year, the others being the Atlanta Hawks, Portland Trail Blazers, Phoenix Suns, New York Knicks, Golden State Warriors and Lakers.

“Everything is with logistics now,” Dan said. “They’re finding that spacing the floor and certain shots are more valuable than other shots. Probably the most valuable is the three-point shot.

Kupchak echoed similar sentiments.

"The rules today promote that style of play,” he said. “There are actually coaches today that tell their team we’re going to score in one of three ways: free throws, layups and three-pointers. The idea of a two-point shot doesn’t even come up in a conversation with some coaches. That’s just the way it is today.”

Starting in 1994, the NBA eliminated hand checking, in essence giving more of an advantage to the offensive player.

In 1997, the league cut down on the “no-charge area,” from a two-by-six foot box to an area to a half-circle with a four-foot radius. This rule change encouraged offensive players to get to the rim or get fouled and go to the free-throw line. Two years later, the league eliminated contact with hands and forearms by defenders in the backcourt and frontcourt, unless the offensiveplayer was below the free-throw line extended.

“When they said you couldn’t put hands on defenders, it allows for easier penetration,” Dan said. “In Phoenix, we were one of the NBA leaders in points in the paint and the reason we were able to do that is because we pulled the defenders out of there that allows that drive and penetration and quickness and mobility of a five or a four to move around and get to the rim against players that aren’t quite as mobile.”

In 2001, illegal defense guidelines were eliminated entirely, and a new defensive three-second rule prohibited defensive players from remaining in the key for more than three consecutive seconds without guarding an offensive player. Again, this placed more importance on players on the weak side, or shooters who could space the floor were much more valuable.

“It’s essential that spacing is maintained and takes away the defense,” Dan continued. “That way when you beat your man – which we use the pick and roll a lot to do – to get into the paint, the defender has to come a long way and then he has a long way to recover, and that’s when we’re throwing the ball out and trying to get as many layups, (free throws) and three-point shots.”

For most teams now, that is what they will do: put the five best players on the floor and try to maximize their skill sets.

“We should name it skill ball,” Dan said. “You’re playing guys that are skilled. You see that across the line. Miami has shown that. I thought we showed it at times in Phoenix. Your five best guys are going to get on the floor and play, and you’ll find the right position for them.”
post #14544 of 18041
I read somewhere that playoff teams that lose their first game at home win 64% of the time at game two. So pacers seem to be pretty pissed they lost the first game that badly. All starters sat down so it looks like a done game. Hawks are prolly happy that they won a game on the road
post #14545 of 18041
Oh please, people need to jump of D'Antoni's dick. The reality is, he has not won anything. He had a good run in Phoenix by having one of the best point guards to ever play the game and Stats in his prime. But what is his record outside of Phoenix? How well has his system worked in LA and in NY? The man should be run out of LA for his awful coaching which turned Gasol into a mediocre player. San Anrtonio and Miami do not play Mike D'Antoni basketball, they have much more traditional lineups. This year's potential winners outside of SA and Miami (Indiana, Portland, LA, NJ, OKC) all have much more in common with traditional lineups than they do with anything D'Antoni has ever done. D'Antoni would make a great college coach, his system has not worked in the NBA, I don't know where he gets all this love from.
post #14546 of 18041
Thread Starter 
Damn, still stings from what he did in NY, eh? lol8[1].gif At least you got Linsanity!


I'm a Laker fan and as much as I'd like to hate the guy, the line-ups just didn't work out for him because he never got a complete and healthy bench. This year needs no explanation but even last year, Dwight and Nash were never 100% with Pau missing 30+ games and when he played, he was just like Dwight and very limited. Not to mention Stern screwing them out of the CP3 trade.

I do wish D'Antoni leaves now but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't curious how last season could have turned out if everyone were 100% healthy. They made a decent final push towards the end of the season last year and again they were simply screwed by Kobes injury. They faced the Spurs in the first round so they would have lost anyways but maybe they could have at least won one game if Kobe was there? lol8[1].gif
post #14547 of 18041
D'antonis system worked well last year and after linsanity when mike Woodson used the exact same sets but the team started playing defense better. This year woodson abandons d'antonis system and now they suck (also they lost their good 3 shooters)

Nets also don't have anything common with traditional lineups. Their tallest center (without Lopez) is 6 11 and on the skinny side. Their front court is small and their backcourt is tall
post #14548 of 18041
From the casual observer, Pringles biggest problem is (was) his refusal to run a system suited for his players. He seems to be a system-coach and doesn't coach to the strength of his players. Didn't he freeze out Pau last season? If you can't run a system to take advantage of Pau's strengths, you've got a problem.
post #14549 of 18041
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFX45 View Post

Damn, still stings from what he did in NY, eh? lol8[1].gif At least you got Linsanity!


No, I don't care about the guy now but its just I see these silly type of articles every once in a while, where they talk about D'Antoni like he's Red Auerbach. D'Antoni has not won anything. He has had success with 1 out of 3 teams he has coached. Chuck Daly did the stretch 4/5 thing with Laimbeer, and they won championships, but no one talks about him. D"Antoni system is good when you have a very good point guard and athletic layers that can run up and down. I don't think that style will ever beat a more traditional lineup/style of play.
post #14550 of 18041
But the article points out a lot of recent champions that have used ideas core to d'antonis system. The last three champions haven't used a traditional lineup

Randy Wittman just iced his own player. Nullified a 3 point shot by calling timeout
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