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Can "Messrs." include a female?

post #1 of 18
8/25/10 at 4:52pm
Thread Starter 
Editing a novel I wrote a few years back and I am talking about two men and woman. Is it appropriate to say "Messrs. Jones, Smith, and Johnson?"

I'm thinking not, because it;s short for Messiuers, but google-fu hasn't revealed the exact answer.
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post #2 of 18
8/25/10 at 4:57pm
I've always believed it to be a masculine term, but I've never had any formal justification for this. Maybe check out the Oxford English Dictionary or EtymOnline (I find etymology often answers "proper usage" questions fairly well.
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post #3 of 18
8/25/10 at 5:01pm
Follow up, having looked at a couple of etymology books the following is a common answer:
Quote:
The pl. Messrs. (1779) is an abbreviation of Fr. messieurs, pl. of monsieur, used in English to supply the pl. of Mr., which is lacking.
Plural of Mr, not a collective noun and therefore not applicable to a non-Mr.
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post #4 of 18
8/25/10 at 5:05pm
Its only for dudes.
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post #5 of 18
8/25/10 at 5:06pm
Messrs. Jones, Smith and Mme. Johnson
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post #6 of 18
8/25/10 at 5:06pm
But don't you use 'ils' for a mixed group? Possibly analogous?
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post #7 of 18
8/25/10 at 5:06pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhood View Post
Follow up, having looked at a couple of etymology books the following is a common answer:



Plural of Mr, not a collective noun and therefore not applicable to a non-Mr.

Thanks, appreciate it.
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post #8 of 18
8/25/10 at 5:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Working Stiff View Post
But don't you use 'ils' for a mixed group? Possibly analogous?

not analogous
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post #9 of 18
8/25/10 at 6:23pm
So what do you use for a mixed group? I know FLMM is from the south but I don't think Y'All will go over well on a formal document.
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post #10 of 18
8/25/10 at 6:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnGalt View Post
Messrs. Jones, Smith and Mme. Johnson

I would use Messrs. Jones, Smith and Ms. Johnson. But that's just me.
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post #11 of 18
8/25/10 at 7:16pm
messiuers jones, smith and mme johnson
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post #12 of 18
8/25/10 at 9:14pm
Why not just use Mr. and Mrs.?
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post #13 of 18
8/25/10 at 11:12pm
Thread Starter 
...
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post #14 of 18
8/25/10 at 11:13pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnGalt View Post
Messrs. Jones, Smith and Mme. Johnson

Quote:
Originally Posted by odoreater View Post
I would use Messrs. Jones, Smith and Ms. Johnson. But that's just me.

Thanks guys, appreciate the help. I'm going to go with this one.

I appreciate all the input, ya'll!
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post #15 of 18
8/25/10 at 11:19pm
Related question: when spoken aloud, is Messrs. PRONOUNCED "Messers" or "Misters" - i.e. "Messers Smith and White" vs. "Misters Smith and White"?
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