Has Borrelli lowered his quality this season?

sho'nuff · May 28, 2010

Originally Posted by dmipol1

His shirts appear to be from the old production but you need to see very detailed pictures to tell exactly. On the other hand, this shirt is definitely from the new bunch:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...fvi%3D1&_rdc=1

thanks.

i look at that ebay link and i still cant tell how you can tell ,but thanks still.

dmipol1 · May 28, 2010

exactly! that's my point.
but some SF members are so finicky that they inspect the seams through the microscope.
that's why I've decided against offering these shirts here to avoid all this hassle

P.S. Machine-made buttonholes look neat, while the handstiched buttonholes are characterized by the larger and often more erratic stitches
Presumably the latter are more resilient (though I saw the evidence to the contrary with my MTM Borrelli shirts) and look cooler.
There is no scientific evidence that one method is superior to another.

winston · May 29, 2010

If the pictures are good enough, I can tell immediately by the buttonholes and also the shoulder seams.

It's strange that so many of these new shirts are popping up for sale already at prices below retail.

sho'nuff · May 29, 2010

i wonder if the new shirts still have the same great fit

winston · May 29, 2010

Originally Posted by sho'nuff

i wonder if the new shirts still have the same great fit
These new ones which are popping up on ebay seem to be slimmer than the old ones, which from my point of view is a good thing. See the measurements on dmipol1's listings, which match measurements from another seller from Italy. dmipol1's prices are fair, IMO.

sho'nuff · May 29, 2010

yeah i saw the measurements on dmipol's listings. the size 16 has the same chest but the shoulder on back is 18 something down from 19.75 from Ian's listing. so its slimmer in the shoulder (?) but it may just be a difference in how theyre measureing the shoulders ( a bit harder to do than just plain pit to pit)

sho'nuff · May 29, 2010

are these hand stitched button holes or machine?

imageWIS · May 29, 2010

Originally Posted by dmipol1

P.S. Machine-made buttonholes look neat, while the handstiched buttonholes are characterized by the larger and often more erratic stitches
Presumably the latter are more resilient (though I saw the evidence to the contrary with my MTM Borrelli shirts) and look cooler.
There is no scientific evidence that one method is superior to another.

I think that when it comes to shirts, some parts are better left to machines than to the hand of (wo)man; primarily the buttonholes.

Chips · May 29, 2010

I'm looking real close at my Borrelli, ( not a 2010 item) and the buttonholes look exactly the same as your first pic, but the second it's too hard to tell, since so little of the stitching is visible. I'm far from an expert, so take it for what it's worth.

winston · May 29, 2010

Originally Posted by sho'nuff

are these hand stitched button holes or machine?
Those are hand sewn. I'm 100% certain.

sho'nuff · May 29, 2010

Originally Posted by Chips

I'm looking real close at my Borrelli, ( not a 2010 item) and the buttonholes look exactly the same as your first pic, but the second it's too hard to tell, since so little of the stitching is visible. I'm far from an expert, so take it for what it's worth.

Originally Posted by winston

Those are hand sewn.

thanks !

SpallaCamiccia · May 29, 2010

Originally Posted by dmipol1

My 2p worth contribution on this vital topic. Don't shoot the messenger.
I'm currently selling a bunch of Borrelli shirts (2010 season) on eBay and researched these issues pretty extensively. Here are some of my key findings:
1. I can't give 100% assurance but there is a gossip that the brand has been taken over (essentially bailed out) by Giampaolo, another shirtmaker
2. They are currently using faster production methods (3-4 manual operations vs. 7-8 before). It probably detracted from the overall perception of quality but in reality the shirts started looking more durable.
3. The most critical elements (armholes) are handstitched and the fit is exceptional (the legacy traditions are well maintained). They are still produced by the expert seamstresses.
4. I would strongly disagree with the poster: the fabrics are top notch!
5. The amount of handwork is AT LEAST on par with Finamore's and Barba's main lines but the fabrics and fit are generally NICER. Still worth every penny.
6. The retail prices in Italy would remain largely unchanged - â‚¬210-240 range

Here is the link to my current auctions:
http://shop.ebay.com/dmipol72/m.html...&_trksid=p4340
If you are interested, please give me a shout and we could possibly make a better deal.
Forgive my small marketing gimmick. I just could not stay silent as there is too much unwarranted speculation

I have to disagree, the old Borrellis that I have got very nice cotton, as sea island. That one hasnÂ´t. Not sure about yours, I also donÂ´t want to screw your auctions.

Originally Posted by sho'nuff

just wondering if the current borrellis on virtualclotheshorse and shopthefinest are the 2010 non-borrelli made ones or the original borrelli made ones?

Those are old ones, so better ones. I just received one from Lance.

Originally Posted by sho'nuff

Lance for example is cool guy, but he sometimes doesnt give clear answers. also he doesnt know alot of the times when i ask him these things and it just seems like im bothering him with 'nitpicky' things about my one or two purchases

I bother him a lot about that. He must hate me

Originally Posted by imageWIS

I think that when it comes to shirts, some parts are better left to machines than to the hand of (wo)man; primarily the buttonholes.

Yes.

sho'nuff · May 30, 2010

thanks. yeah lance is a cool guy but i can imagine him doing this

on occasion when i ask him certain questions.

im going to take your word for it and not get any of those 2010s but did yours 2010 have the waterfall on the shoulder/sleeve seam as well?

dmipol1 · May 30, 2010

SpallaCamiccia;3269119 said:
I have to disagree, the old Borrellis that I have got very nice cotton, as sea island. That one hasnÂ´t. Not sure about yours, I also donÂ´t want to screw your auctions.

I respect your opinion, but I owned about 40-50 of "old" Borrelli's, probably more than anyone else here and can certify that fabrics used for standard RTW shirts were pretty lame (the same applies to Finamore, Barba, etc).
Royal Collection is a different story but they are ~50% more expensive. For MTM Borrelli shirts I had to go for category 7 or 8 (some of the most luxurious and pricey fabrics) to ensure a decent quality. They cost me €350 per shirt in Napoli, in line with Matuozzo (made of Riva), for which I paid €360.

I can also attest that the fabrics used for the new generation of Borrelli's are not as bad as you try to portray them. Borrelli, Finamore, Barba, Isaia, etc. source them from the same producers (their bunches for MTM service look very similar).
Even with all of the above caveats (machine-made buttonholes, etc.), at $120-130 these new shirts are a steal!
With due respect, I would better buy this new Borrelli than TF or something similar...

dmipol1 · May 30, 2010

Originally Posted by winston

If the pictures are good enough, I can tell immediately by the buttonholes and also the shoulder seams. It's strange that so many of these new shirts are popping up for sale already at prices below retail.
You must be simply unaware of that the retail price is a high multiple of a wholesale price. Some producers sell only to authorised resellers (which adhere to the RRPs), but some merchandise could leak to the cowboys like us.

Has Borrelli lowered his quality this season?

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