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Cars We Drive! - Page 566

post #8476 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huntsman View Post

3GT : Hunchback of Munich

 


Get out of my bell tower, said the first gen X3.
post #8477 of 15418
Just saw a champagne colored convertible E Type in San Juan. Beautiful.
post #8478 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Huntsman View Post

3GT : Hunchback of Munich
Get out of my bell tower, said the first gen X3.

 

Truly.

 

Quote:

 

Originally Posted by Pilot View Post

Just saw a champagne colored convertible E Type in San Juan. Beautiful.

 

I love some of the newer supercars, and would do evil things for a DB9; however, if you are driving an E-type you just have to be cooler than the taste plebes in their Ferraris, Bentleys, et al, because for you it is clearly a matter of passion, not merely one of capital.

 

~ H

post #8479 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by dah328 View Post

Who knew that second differential on an AWD vehicle actually changed tire composition, suspension geometry, and weight distribution when adverse weather conditions were detected?

Do you consider traction to be part of a car's handling characteristics?
post #8480 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by dah328 View Post

This reminds me of Piobaire's insistence a little while back that AWD vehicles handle better than FWD or RWD in adverse weather conditions. Who knew that second differential on an AWD vehicle actually changed tire composition, suspension geometry, and weight distribution when adverse weather conditions were detected?

Huh? WTF are you talking about?

Idfnl, I lmfao that you had to reply but cut out reference to me. Lulz.
post #8481 of 15418
Saw a c63 coupe parked next to me after dinner -- what a gorgeous car..
post #8482 of 15418
Traction defines handling...

What is the first handling characteristic you think of on an old 911? Lift off oversteer.

Why are most cars tuned for understeer bias? Well, what is an 18 year old going to do when he is trying to impress his date but then finds himself barreling off the road? Take his foot off the gas.
post #8483 of 15418
AWD gives four chances for traction vs. two in a FWD or RWD car. If someone wants to make the case, that when the only variable is 2WD vs. AWD, that the AWD is not inherently going to provide more chances for traction I'm all for reading about that.
post #8484 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post

AWD gives four chances for traction vs. two in a FWD or RWD car. If someone wants to make the case, that when the only variable is 2WD vs. AWD, that the AWD is not inherently going to provide more chances for traction I'm all for reading about that.

I step on the brakes or turn the steering wheel. How does AWD give me more "chances for traction" in either of those situations?
post #8485 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by dah328 View Post

I step on the brakes or turn the steering wheel. How does AWD give me more "chances for traction" in either of those situations?

As for braking it does not. As I never maintained it did this is a straw man. This however is not the complete summation of the situation, now is it? There is acceleration (4 chances vs. two) and even in turning 4WD or AWD is superior. Have you ever driven such a vehicle in snowy conditions?
post #8486 of 15418
post #8487 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by dah328 View Post

I step on the brakes or turn the steering wheel. How does AWD give me more "chances for traction" in either of those situations?

As for braking it does not. As I never maintained it did this is a straw man. This however is not the complete summation of the situation, now is it? There is acceleration (4 chances vs. two) and even in turning 4WD or AWD is superior. Have you ever driven such a vehicle in snowy conditions?

There is no AWD advantage when turning. There is an advantage when accelerating under some but not all conditions. So what you are left with is no advantage when braking or turning and an advantage under select circumstances when accelerating. The first two are critical for safe driving in adverse conditions. The last is much less important.
post #8488 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by dah328 View Post

There is no AWD advantage when turning. There is an advantage when accelerating under some but not all conditions. So what you are left with is no advantage when braking or turning and an advantage under select circumstances when accelerating. The first two are critical for safe driving in adverse conditions. The last is much less important.

You have never driven a 4WD or AWD in heavy snow, have you?

And I disagree with the characterization of "select circumstances." 4 vs. 2 in every situation.
post #8489 of 15418
Quote:
Originally Posted by Piobaire View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by dah328 View Post

There is no AWD advantage when turning. There is an advantage when accelerating under some but not all conditions. So what you are left with is no advantage when braking or turning and an advantage under select circumstances when accelerating. The first two are critical for safe driving in adverse conditions. The last is much less important.

You have never driven a 4WD or AWD in heavy snow, have you?

And I disagree with the characterization of "select circumstances." 4 vs. 2 in every situation.

I have although it's not relevant since one does not have to do that in order to understand basic physics.
post #8490 of 15418
Traction != Handling for everything.

Well...depending on what you're trying to do. In adverse weather conditions traction in all modes of driving, acceleration, cornering, braking, is pretty much the most important thing.

Winter Tires on FWD/RWD > All Seasons on AWD

A little anecdotal experience: I had Winter Tires on my FWD car and drove through 3 inches on i90 just fine (not at normal interstate speeds, obviously). My buddy in the same storm had to drive 20mph slower using an AWD car with All Seasons. I understand there are many other factors involved in this case, just pointing out that the proper tire for the job is more important than the drivetrain.

That said, ideally I'd have an AWD system with winter tires.
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