or Connect
Styleforum › Forums › Culture › Fine Living, Home, Design & Auto › Cars We Drive!
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Cars We Drive! - Page 1417

post #21241 of 26272
That was my point - they all represent a great engine. From the YZR-M1 to the Aventador to a Tesla.

I'm not getting the complete dismissal of turbo lag when I doubt very few people here have driven an M4 or a McLaren or the like. Or even heard a P1 in real life.

Anyhow, I'll see myself out.
post #21242 of 26272
I drive a current a C63S and the turbo lag is virtually non-existent. Turbos have come a long way the past 10-15 years. There is a split second delay if I'm driving in comfort mode and I need to punch it where the car will drop gears into 5 or 6 but it's hardly noticeable.

My older brother had a 1994 or 1995 Supra and even with the stock turbos, there was a decent amount of lag. He upgraded the turbo to a bigger one (a T67 turbo I think) and that lag was ridiculous. But once it kicked in, you were thrown back.
post #21243 of 26272
Quote:
Originally Posted by ramuman View Post

I've never suggested turbo engines are the end all. The exhaust note thing comes about when you keep posting about 'dat exhaust tho' - it wasn't changing the point of the discussion when it clearly had deviated towards V10s and V12s being better sounding. Yet (with the exception of you catching my ninja edit of the P1), no one could correctly tell the difference between a Yamaha Moto GP bike and an Aventador or Tesla without me posting it.

For the record, I loved my E92 M3. I love my F82 M4 even more. Again, as Chris Harris said, because of the engine, not in spite of it.

You cannot boldly state the above as indisputable truth (<-- and this statement is fact) because you posted the answers before anyone posted their guesses. This gives you the easy out of saying "oh you only got it because I told you already." What if no one read through the rest of the thread before listening to your clips? You may believe all you want that no one would have guessed correctly, but the E92 M3, the F8X M3 / M4, and Aventador are very, very easy to identify (to me, at least, despite having never owned any of them, which seems to be your sole criterion for having the right to say you know anything about the cars).

Not to mention, you changed the rules of the game each time you posted a clip. First, you tasked us with identifying the engine configuration, down to whether it was inline, flat, or V-shaped. But you gave the answers in the form of what specific make and model the car was. Yes, that tells you the engine configuration by default, but let's get technical here as you so like to do. There is a difference between saying "that sounds like a V8" vs. "that sounds like the E92 M3."

Then you quizzed me on the second round to figure out the engine type and make of the car (this was for the P1). And on the third round, with the Moto GP, you said I had to guess the model and YEAR. On top of that, you threw in the curveball of saying it had 2, 3, and 4 wheel applications. Wat?

I've point blank asked you three times already, I think, what the quizzes have to do with one's preference for larger, naturally aspirated engines. You've skirted it every single time. If you posted a clip of a twin turbo V6 exhaust note and I stated (incorrectly) it was indisputably the exhaust from a V10, then I think you have a point. But distinguishing a flat four from a V8 from a V12? Pointless and irrelevant to the topic at hand.

I'll state this clearly again: I'm not saying that a turbocharged engine can't sound good. I'm not saying that only large, NA engines can sound good. A good exhaust sounds good, regardless of what engine configuration it comes from.

I, and others, are only stating preferences here and you're getting angry that we haven't "seen the light" of turbo applications it seems.. as if we're just wrong for preferring NA engines. As an exhaust whore, if I walked into an Audi dealership and asked for the R8 V10+ but was told it was replaced with a twin turbo V6, you can bet your ass I would walk out, regardless of how well it performs or handles. And this was my entire point from the very beginning: that a downsized, turbocharged engine for everyday road car usage simply cannot have its exhaust be engineered to sound like its predecessor V8, V10, V12, or what have you. I've never driven an M4, but I believe you and others when they say it has no discernible turbo lag. Notice how I never brought it up as a point of contention against turbo engines. I've focused on exhausts only.

I think you have this engineering mindset where your stance is that turbocharged engines are superior when you tally up all its pros and cons -- that it's objectively, and therefore, logically, the way to go. But people are irrational. Their choices and preferences for cars are driven by emotions as much as they are by cold, hard facts.

Perhaps it was unfair for us to debate on this topic, as I was clearly focused on one aspect of turbo engines while you were busy volleying different points from others and perhaps got lost in the nonsense of this all.
post #21244 of 26272
Quote:
Originally Posted by HRoi View Post

oh, i got this. everyone sit down.

fire engine - waaaaaaaah wah wah wah wah wah ratatatatatatat

ambulance - wooooaaaah wah wah wah wah wah wah wah neenooneenooneenoo

police car - waaaaaooow waaaaooow waaaaaooow waaaaooow waaaaooow


you guys may have it different in Europe though. my paypal is d0uch3@iwintheinternet.net



Close, but no cigar, you get nothing.
post #21245 of 26272
This is why people dislike turbos.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jS4Dh_EAfJI
post #21246 of 26272
I prefer the 2014; nice and quiet.
post #21247 of 26272
@greenfrog

If you find a post where I imply that you haven't seen the light of turbos, cool - link me.

I never once in this thread said turbos are flatly superior. If anything, the only thing I've implied is that electric motors are superior - and obviously have very little soul. I absolutely love my Tesla, but I relegate it to road trips with my friends.

The M4 is far more theatrical, and that has merit. I also miss my M3. My friend's 570 for the week also sounded great.

I was more pissed off at the use of turbo lag and yada yada. If people don't know how advanced high-end turbos are today from the Inconel rotors to the ECU management, the transmissions, and the intake and exhaust around them, then you might as well be reading off complaints from a 1995 issue of Road and Track.

If you got in my M4 and drove it in it's default mode, it'd seem extremely lazy. However I have it coded that way because every stoplight isn't a drag strip christmas tree. If you press M2 twice, I'd be really surprised if you noticed turbo lag.

If Audi had a great turbo'd R8, I'd love to have one. If McLaren made one...oh wait. If Porsche made one...oh wait. If Formula 1 made one...oh wait. If BMW made one...oh wait.

It's 2016, people need to admit that. A great car is simply a great car on so many factors that come together.

Also, I gave the forum, on a lazy Sat., an hour to guess the engine type. My own answers were specific, but the replies didn't need to be much more than the number of cylinders. All cars were/are not super rare - I didn't post the Benz motorwagen

Edit: Also the last sentence of your last post was about as ad hominem as it gets.
Edited by ramuman - 3/13/16 at 11:30am
post #21248 of 26272
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texasmade View Post

I drive a current a C63S and the turbo lag is virtually non-existent. Turbos have come a long way the past 10-15 years. There is a split second delay if I'm driving in comfort mode and I need to punch it where the car will drop gears into 5 or 6 but it's hardly noticeable.

My older brother had a 1994 or 1995 Supra and even with the stock turbos, there was a decent amount of lag. He upgraded the turbo to a bigger one (a T67 turbo I think) and that lag was ridiculous. But once it kicked in, you were thrown back.

You get it. Nice car as well btw.
post #21249 of 26272
Quote:
Originally Posted by Find Finn View Post

Close, but no cigar, you get nothing.

You'd like this - I have a Lego fire engine from years ago and it does the Danish/European sound.
post #21250 of 26272
I had the pleasure of driving an M4 w/ M-Performance exhaust yesterday morning. In a word: WOW. I couldn't imagine owning the M4 without this exhaust.

Great car; thoroughly enjoyed driving it. Still doesn't compare to the E46 though shog[1].gif
post #21251 of 26272
One last example - unlimited time, no money, jump to 20s. 4 wheel car and should be a super easy guess.

https://clyp.it/uhh2aeth
post #21252 of 26272
Quote:
Originally Posted by bawlin View Post

I had the pleasure of driving an M4 w/ M-Performance exhaust yesterday morning. In a word: WOW. I couldn't imagine owning the M4 without this exhaust.

Great car; thoroughly enjoyed driving it. Still doesn't compare to the E46 though shog[1].gif

That plus the CAN terminating resistor make a huge difference. My first M4 had neither and my neighbor has one of the early ones without either. The terminating resistor (which was a BMW screw up) alone makes a huge difference. With the exhaust, forget about it.
post #21253 of 26272
Quote:
Originally Posted by ramuman View Post

One last example - unlimited time, no money, jump to 20s. 4 wheel car and should be a super easy guess.

https://clyp.it/uhh2aeth

Lexus LFA.

BTW, will not address your last post because it's clear we can't have a productive dialogue.
post #21254 of 26272
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenFrog View Post

Lexus LFA.

BTW, will not address your last post because it's clear we can't have a productive dialogue.

Snuggle buddies. Dude, I have no issue with you. I tend to think like an engineer or physicist and that blows up in my face quite a bit, as demonstrated here.

I knew you'd nail this.
post #21255 of 26272
Back to the happier days - hell of a save, but still likely out a few k:
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
Styleforum › Forums › Culture › Fine Living, Home, Design & Auto › Cars We Drive!