Shoe Damage Report & Shoe P0rn Central - Part II



greekgeek said:

American version.

Click to expand...

HA! A vintage man after my own heart. By the way, when you get the chance, please send me those vintage shoe pics you mentioned.

alden ravello
argyles otc

fritzl said:

alright, let's forget for a second that the second pair is a dover. imo, and to my mind, it's rather obvious that a heel counter is breaking the lines of the "wholecut" concept from the original norweger. i'm pretty much convinced that the norweger is predestinated for bespoke or to makers who can read a last and understand the importance of authenticity.
i cannot buy in the groupthink that this has become a fashion item or at least a darling hence to the fact: when porty boy has one, it must be good.
sorry, i'm definitely not for that.
in addition, i'm not biased at all. though, let's face it, it's a shoe and the perfect execution which accompanies me since my interest in shoes has arisen.
just my two cents.

Click to expand...

IDon't fully understand you G. Vass calls the Norweger flamboyant and controversial ,and a variation of the Blucher, but nowhere (I Know of) a whole-cut.

A whole-cut upper, with none or one functional seam, usually at the back, is different to the Norweger in the Vass iteration with 3 seams and a 3 piece upper. The Dover has 4 seams, and a counter which you've said doesn't balance. To my eye it does exactly that.

Looking side on, the Dover's centrepoint has a piecrust vamp on one side, and the rounded counter on the other. To me that's balance, and it's consistent with the fact that the Norweger is a variant of the Derby, which commonly does have a counter.

The Dover may be a hybrid, but it's hard to deny the craft of it. The ghosted split toe seam, and the piecrust top seam have more complex work than the Vass version hands down. I'd hate to see that skill decline.

What I really like about the Norweger idea is its stability and simplicity of design. In its purest form the Norweger is just 3 pieces of leather stitched together to provide a roomy, toe-friendly chamber. Like a moccasin.

As for 'fashion item', the Norweger is as fashionable as Porty boy is a trend setter- which is to say not at all. No offence to him, but has he even posted in the last couple years? And has anyone replaced him? No Norweger, no matter who rocks it, will ever have the cache of a sleek bal, more's the pity, because in the rite context have just the right combination of informality, comfort and simplicity .

greekgeek said:

American version.

Click to expand...

maybe not black tho.



fritzl said:

......a heel counter is breaking the lines of the "wholecut" concept from the original norweger. i'm pretty much convinced that the norweger is predestinated for bespoke or to makers who can read a last and understand the importance of authenticity.

Click to expand...

Here is a video in Norwegian (language) showing a Norwegian (Jan Petter Myhre) making a Norwegian (shoe).
Can it get more authentic than that? That shoe has, shock, horror, a heel-counter.


[VIDEO][/VIDEO]

fritzl said:

......i'm not biased at all.

Click to expand...

Goodness - Nobody would presume that!!!



aj_del said:

I bought the Ron Rider NSTs before this. They also looked great but there were some issues with that particular pair and I had to return those.
Ron's pic

Click to expand...

I think these are great. Any more information on them? Cannot find any on the web at all. Still able to purchased?

I dont think they are in production any longer

fritzl said:

luk-cha said:

the vass and the EG are great looking but i dont like the desing of the halmos seems neather here nor there to me but still looks a well made shoe

Click to expand...

alright, let's forget for a second that the second pair is a dover. imo, and to my mind, it's rather obvious that a heel counter is breaking the lines of the "wholecut" concept from the original norweger. i'm pretty much convinced that the norweger is predestinated for bespoke or to makers who can read a last and understand the importance of authenticity.

i cannot buy in the groupthink that this has become a fashion item or at least a darling hence to the fact: when porty boy has one, it must be good.
sorry, i'm definitely not for that.

in addition, i'm not biased at all. though, let's face it, it's a shoe and the perfect execution which accompanies me since my interest in shoes has arisen.

just my two cents.

Click to expand...

on the dover i dont get why there need to be a HC other than for strengthening the support of the ancle or its an English thing, i do like the clean lines of the vass but i prefer the wat the dover is hand stitched on the vamp

on the halmos that to me is just a mess design wises and looks like a italian shoe pretending to be a US syled version - big fail for me!



luk-cha said:

.....on the dover i dont get why there need to be a HC other than for strengthening......

Click to expand...

I do believe the heel-counter balances the heavy toe, so it makes the shoe less front-heavy. By the same token, French makers like to run an additional seam below the top line (this example is Weston’s “Chasse”).



Presumably it serves the same purpose as the heel-counter: adding a ying to the yang and making the design more balanced.



bengal-stripe said:

I do believe the heel-counter balances the heavy toe, so it makes the shoe less front-heavy. By the same token, French makers like to run an additional seam below the top line (this example is Weston’s “Chasse”).

Presumably it serves the same purpose as the heel-counter: adding a ying to the yang and making the design more balanced.

Click to expand...

that's a Grail Shoe for me.



Pliny said:

The Dover may be a hybrid, but it's hard to deny the craft of it.
 

Click to expand...

i do, anyway.



luk-cha said:

... but i prefer the wat the dover is hand stitched on the vamp
!

Click to expand...

the vass looks handstitched to me.



isshinryu101 said:

HA! A vintage man after my own heart. By the way, when you get the chance, please send me those vintage shoe pics you mentioned.

Click to expand...

Ah yes, coming soon. Turns out I deleted those which I had already taken...

fritzl said:

the vass looks handstitched to me.

Click to expand...

be interested in DWF 's opinion- they look handstiched to me, which adds to the rusticity and authenticity. But then so does the C&J Onslow in cordovan (bottom) with its irregularites, and I'd be surprised if it's a hand job. Anyone know ?

isshinryu101 said:

that's a Grail Shoe for me.

Click to expand...

Issh- for me too, although whenever I see it in user pics it looks a little blobby and bulky. A real beater. Have to wait to see it in person.



Pliny said:

be interested in DWF 's opinion-  they look handstiched to me, which adds to the rusticity and authenticity.  But then so does the C&J Onslow in cordovan (bottom) with its irregularites,  and I'd be surprised if it's a hand job.  Anyone know ?

Click to expand...

How can you know for sure? The only one that is absolutely certainly hand stitched is the upper left hand shoe. The stitching on the apron is "split and lift" and that cannot be done by machine.

That said, at a guess I would say they were all hand stitched.

FWIW, in the new CJ catalog, there are 2 models in the handgrade range with the apron and they are explicitly mentioned as hands titched. The models in the benchgrade line are silent as to the stitching aspect