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Unattractiveness and the discussion of style - Page 6

post #76 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arnold_Horseshack
that your picture??? i mean im the first person to say i aint good lookin but i dont think you nothing to brag about either....

post #77 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitonbrioni
The only style requirement of a gentleman is to be at the arm of an attractive lady.
Most sensible answer so far.
post #78 of 170
Thread Starter 
I think Gorgekko made an interesting point about wanting to be Humphrey Bogart, or to quote him directly “what man wouldn't want to be him?”—style as it is discussed here, and pondered about by myself, has an element of wanting to be like someone else. Deep down I always thought that to truly be secure with one’s self is not wanting to be, or be like anyone else; even if that person in wears Brioni and drives an Aston Martin. Sometimes it seems like a momentum task to get over these insecurities that have been layered and built upon since childhood; one that's even more difficult than securing a place of respect in the world based on ability and talent.

Tiger, if you cannot determine if a man is attractive or not, how do you go about formulating an opinion on your own attractiveness, or have you never thought about it?
post #79 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by thealbatross
Part if not all of my original point was about compensating for low self-esteem or a prevailing feeling of unattractiveness, which in my case was formulated in my mind early in life, with the pursuit of style. This isn't to say that unattractive people are inherently more stylish, just that they are trying harder. Many of the things discussed on the forums don't even necessarily have to do with style but rather the acquisition of things that perhaps makes us feel better about ourselves, such as a bespoke garment that may not only flatter our body types, but also deliver a confidence boost by virtue of being a luxury item.

Most of us would prefer to change something about out physical appearance. Some may compensate entirely through the fleeting gratification provided by the acqisition of luxury items, but I've yet to meet such a person. The men I've met who compensate for some less than ideal feature of their appearance tend to do so through plainness of dress so as not to attract attention.

Where luxury is concerned, I find the payoff to be in comfort rather than in the mere possession of some luxury item; you can pay a lot for a suit because the brand name is high profile, but feel like you're spending the whole day shut up in a box, or you can take the trouble to be informed and spend your money on a suit that will make you feel like you're spending your whole day lounging around in pajamas and will look fantastic to anyone who also has an eye for fine tailoring. And if nobody has such an eye, you still end up looking well-dressed but not so different from everybody else.

Personally, I find dressing well and having nice things is a fun hobby. I derive joy from wearing parts of my collection. Compensation of the type you imply doesn't really enter into the picture.

If I am compensating for anything, it's the rigor of a work day that lasts 12 hours minimum and involves hours on end of drudgery and requires that I look fresh and sharp the entire time. In meeting this challenge, looks come behind smelling nice all day long and maintaining a pleasant attitude that makes the daily grind just that much more bearable for your coworkers, whose lives may suck far worse than yours, no matter what you look like.

In other words, there may be something to your question, but you've asked in such a way as to deliver the fatal blow to a straw man.

I still maintain that style entails a greater diversity of elements than just looks. This fact may be difficult to bear in mind on an internet forum that is overhwelmingly visual.
post #80 of 170
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nantucket Red

In other words, there may be something to your question, but you've asked in such a way as to deliver the fatal blow to a straw man.

If this is the case I sincerely hope that I employ more tact in the future. I didn't mean to be hard on any individual or group of people here with the possible exception of myself. I concede to your points as they apply to your own pursuit of style; or luxury, whatever term we want to use, as you seem very clear (internally) with your own intentions. I do think that my original point stands for a large portion of the forum (which I include myself a part of) and even more so now due to the responses I have received in this thread; many which are constructive and honest in their own right even if the participants are not aware of their own candidness.
post #81 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by thealbatross
If this is the case I sincerely hope that I employ more tact in the future. I didn't mean to be hard on any individual or group of people here with the possible exception of myself. I concede to your points as they apply to your own pursuit of style; or luxury, whatever term we want to use, as you seem very clear (internally) with your own intentions. I do think that my original point stands for a large portion of the forum (which I include myself a part of) and even more so now due to the responses I have received in this thread; many which are constructive and honest in their own right even if the participants are not aware of their own candidness.

This thread reminds me of the Seinfeld episode in which Jerry concludes that 95 percent of people are undatable. (UNDATABLE!)

I wonder if this thread isn't built, at least in part, on the presupposition that the participants in a style forum must be dashing, handsome young men dressed to the nines at all times. (The anonymity of the 'Net helps make this believable.) But I imagine we're really just like any other group -- some of us are fat, some thin; some beautiful, some homely. Really, would you consider the majority of society at large to be "attractive"?

Beyond that, I find the evidence too flimsy to make any sweeping conclusions. Some folks, I'm sure, dress well because it aids their appearance, some because it's a way to show off, some because dressing well is its own noble goal. If anything, I'm impressed at how many of our posters seem to fall into the latter category.
post #82 of 170
I am ugly, poor, rude, and I smell funny. But I have a huge package. That totally makes up for it as far as most of the ladies are concerned.
post #83 of 170
I think that the members of this forum are probably more attractive (regardless of clothing) than the average population.
post #84 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by thealbatross
how do you go about formulating an opinion on your own attractiveness, or
Quality of tail pulled.


Seriously though, why would anyone need to judge thier own attractiveness? I'm short so I'd like to be taller, stocky so I need to take that into consideration when I dress. But as far as facial features go, they can't be affected, so who cares?
post #85 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tokyo Slim
I am ugly, poor, rude, and I smell funny. But I have a huge package. That totally makes up for it as far as most of the ladies are concerned.

Ugly ladies or pretty ladies?
post #86 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by kitonbrioni
As is often the case, this discussion is, in general, the middle-brow versus the high-brow and low-brow. Usually the middle-brow sets, preserves and inforces the rules of attractiveness, style and fashion. Often the low-brow is into streetware, etc and conspicuous consumption. Much of the time the high-brow does or doesn't follow the rules of the middle-brow or low-brow, but selects rules from each at their leasure and pleasure while making up their own rules.

So basically you think people that are into streetwear are lowbrow consumerists? Nice analysis...
post #87 of 170
Hi,

There are multiple points to address.

1) Humprey Bogard's facial attractiveness was not bad at the start of his career.

2) Surveys and other evidence suggest that physical attractiveness is more sought after than it used to be.

3) Researchers have found that a man's perceived physical attractiveness is affected by the female companionship he keeps.

4) Many, many studies have found that better-looking candidates are more likely to receive job offers.

5) Judging by findings about online dating and speed dating, which more and more people use these days, male physical attractiveness probably matters more in dating success than in professional success.

6) "Through this study it was found that women and men share the same views on whether the male photos they were exposed to were attractive, neutral or unattractive. Some differences between the sexes surfaced on the extremity of their views of attractive versus unattractive males but were not significant. The men saw both the attractive and unattractive male photos as less attractive than their female counterparts. The significant difference, on the other hand, was between the sexes concerning their views on the neutral male photo. It was found that males viewed the neutral male more positively than the females did."

7) Men overestimate the amount of muscularity that women find attractive in men.
post #88 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiger02
Can you really judge how attractive other dudes are? I can't. I can guess, and sometimes get it right at the extremes, but otherwise have no clue whatsoever.

I can in your case, I love the long black hair, the milky white skin, the almond-shaped eyes and the tastefully applied lipstick on your gorgeous lips...oh wait that's not you nevermind....
post #89 of 170
Quote:
Originally Posted by designprofessor
Ugly ladies or pretty ladies?

Mostly fat, filthy rich, redneck women with no apparent skills, you know, like Britney Spears.
post #90 of 170
Also, although many studies focus on only 3 to 5 levels of attractiveness, research into attractiveness and wealth has found that slight differences add up.
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