HR Issues

It's a difficult job market for finance types right now. As in other professions, nobody wants to invest in training in a recession market. Just because you have military experience doesn't automatically put you ahead of the other new finance graduates. As far as the recruiters is concerned, you have zero finance experience, and on top of that, your finance skills might be a bit rusty since you haven't used it for so long. These new graduates -- wet behind the ears and all -- might have relevant internship experience that will be more useful for the analyst position. Not to downplay your combat experience, but the skills required for shooting terrorists aren't exactly needed when you're working on a financial model in Excel. It might come across as presumptuous -- to the recruiter, at least -- for you to think that you have an advantage because of this over a finance geek with a 3.8 GPA and 3 summers of good finance internship experience. In your case, I think the personal approach is best, i.e. finding someone in the finance world that you can relate to and getting that person to endorse your candidacy. I'm sure there are military types working in finance. Sending resumes blindly to recruiters, either as replies to job postings or a mass mailing campaign, is a waste of your time, IMO. Other than this, going back to school for an MBA will be a tremendous boost to your career. It shows you have both leadership skills (from your military career), and business/finance skills.

ever thought of taking your GI benefit and getting an MBA? when i was in B-school i had at least 20 classmates who were doing exactly that - they were just like you, officers who got great grades - the top schools loved them because of the grades/experience/leadership combo, and the recruiters wanted them because of the same thing. you may not want to invest 2 years into it, but if you do i think you'll get a job a level or two currently above what you're shooting for. i think the issue is not you, it's the glut of experienced, unemployed analysts out there pounding the pavement. i think those kids out of school are having as tough a go as you are. another option is to go into Operations, where your skills would be more valuable as a supervisor/team leader, and then work your way over into the Finance department. EDIT - sorry, DNW posted many of the same things while i was composing, and i ended up being redundant

Jason,

first, thank you for your service

second, here is what I would do. do some research, find a list of financial people, not at the very top of the heap but somewhere in the middle. I am guessing that some internet searches, some talking with veterans groups, a little reading you might be able to come up with a sizable list. then, write a letter that goes someting like:

dear mr. X,

I recently left the military, as a (what ever your rank/ task was) in iraq and I am now readjusting to the challenges of civillian life. Could you spare me an hour of your time to discuss the best way for a person in my posiiton to help successfully transition back into civillian life.



I am guessing that most will agree to meet with you. they'd have to be bastards not to. I would write this on nice stationary, and hand deliver it to their office.

talk to them, tell them the story. I honestly beleive that this will give you a huge push in the right direction.

the HR people are trying to do what the hiring managers have told them. nobody mentioned the military. if the hiring manager's boss suggests that trying out a vet is a good idea, the HR manager will see the situation differently.

good luck

I dislike HR people.

if you are looking for a position as a mananger or supervisor those skills would defiently be a plus, but if you are lookign for positions where no one is under you, knowing how to manage a team is useless, and those itnernships and laundry list of other jobs may have more value.

aww - that's a shame that you're not eligible for the education benefit. so i read your subsequent posts, and while i do understand where you are coming from (and hear your frustration) there is one thing that i would keep in mind - the military style of leadership does not always translate into the corporate world. i would try to get a feel for the culture of the firm you're interested in joining - are people more used to an autocratic/hierarchical style, or are they more collaborative/manage by consensus and influencing. etc? i work for a financial firm, although i run the Ops side, and my firm's culture is more into management by consensus and collaboration. it is a huge firm that is highly matrixed, so you better be good at getting consensus, because 95% of the time the decision you need to make affects someone else's turf. i have hired ex-military officers and some have done spectacularly poorly - these are the folks who think in terms of receiving a task, and using the resources they directly control (i.e. the team) to get it done. they also tended to be the kind of person who had trouble when challenged by direct reports or when needing to bring a bunch of peers and superiors with different agendas to consensus but then there is one person in particular who's done spectacularly well. he's adjusted his leadership style to fit the collaborative environment, softened his approach, but still is fantastic at breaking a "mission" down and finding a way to deliver the result. i'd encourage you to think about ways that you've successfully tailored your leadership style depending on the situation and the people you needed to lead at the time, and have those examples handy to show an interviewer how you'd be able to lead effectively even in a non-military culture. good luck!

When you say financial analyst you're talking like, budgeting kind of work for a fortune 500 company?

I'm just brainstorming here, and know fuck-all about hiring processes outside of my narrow profession, but if I were coming out of the service with your credentials I'd be looking for a different path entirely. You have major leadership/team experience, so go somewhere where such skills are valued.

I know a lot of these big corporations have kind of leadership-training rotations they use to put promising kids on the fast track. You'd probably do a tour on the financial analyst side, but you'd rotate through other areas as well.

Or what about project management/ internal consulting jobs. I know the big banks all have these kind of roles available and take people at the entry level.

You also to get on the deal team somewhere like, say, a regional real estate investment firm.

It seems like smaller management and strategy consulting firms would be interested in someone like you too.


I could be woefully ignorant on all of the above points, but it seems like you could work you way into a job more exciting and with more up advancement opportunities than a traditional financial analyst thing. Putting myself in the shoes of someone hiring, these kind of jobs would actually make more sense in the context of your story.


Also, fuck HR. Their job is to make sure some back-office schmuck is passing a drug test and explain dental benefits. I wouldn't want to be in a position of having these people screen my resume. Do some networking a la Globe's advice and avoid these middle(wo)men.

Kind of been touched upon, but the best advice I was given by a recruiter was this: "Be able to clearly say in your cover letter and in the interview how your [military] experience will help the firm". There are some negative connotations with a military member's ability to adjust to private work, I would guess. So, it is so important to focus on the transferable skills, and maybe even do a tie in that though the military is heirarchical, etc...this is important to achieve objectives when there is not time for consensus building and collaboration, or whatever fuzzy term you want to use. That said, I just can not imagine that there is a better environment for working as a "team" either. It would appear to me to be the best of both worlds, requiring an ability to even switch back and forth between mgmt styles. I realize that this is mgmt focused, but maybe that is the path you should be considering given your experience?

I would really recommend getting an MBA from a top school. It would equalize you with other candidates and take advantage of your years of leadership experience. Going straight from military into a financial analyst career is just not going to happen, not without a big change.

To the OP: I would highly recommend you explore a closely-held company called Cardinal Glass Industries. Cardinal They don't have plants in either Boston or Denver, but the senior management is almost completely USArmy dudes. They hire and promote fellow vets, and pay their management very, very well.

It's not that it's a rung below, it's just not relevant for the work you'll be doing as an entry level financial analyst, particularly when there are 100 other people applying for the same job who've spent several summers doing related stuff while you were in the military. I further totally agree that no internships can substitute for the experience you got in the military and combat, but the point is that aside from general leadership skills, it's not useful with respect to the jobs you're going for.


You can teach anyone anything, but that doesn't mean you should hire them. Between this and your previous post I'm getting the impression that you've got a sizable chip on your shoulder and/or sense of entitlement. Honestly, I can appreciate why, but it just makes you sound bitter and sure as shit makes me less interested in hiring you if I'm an HR person or hiring manager. And you can bet that if you feel this way, it's going to come through in your communications with companies either directly or more subtly. I mean, even in the way you're talking about other "kids'" experience, you're talking down about it and about how your experience in the military is more significant.


I totally agree that you have more to offer. All things equal, I think pretty much anyone would take a 27-year old over a 22-year old. You just happened to come out at during one of the worst jobs markets ever, as an, for all intents and purposes, entry-level applicant with little to no relevant financial experience. Perhaps use your leadership experience as others have suggested and pursue a slightly different avenue initially? Maybe consider the MBA? Or, I see no reason why you can't continue to pound the pavement and work to find your first job like most people do. I think a lot of people hold the misguided belief that by going to college and getting good grades they'll simply get the great job they've always dreamed of and sadly it just doesn't work that way.

Jason,


I re-read your origional post. I had missed that you want to be an analyst. I would think that your skills would lend more to a leadership position, rather than what I would consider to be a specific, "technical" skill that you don't really have any training for. you might be better served either going back to school or trying to get an entry level posiiton to learn the skills needed.

sorry about that.