Allen Edmonds Appreciation Thread - reviews, pictures, sizing, etc...

[wdahab]



those 721ltd that they made up for Wolverine were a great pair that I really regret passing on.

I did too, until the other day when I snagged a pair for $300 from someone who didn't want theirs anymore (they'd only paid $350, so it was a fair price by his reckoning). Slight defects in them, but totally worth it. Oh man are they worth it. The color and the austerity short wing is just... I don't understand why no one else is doing that!

 

[calidist]

Here are some before and after pictures of my AE 5th Aves regarding edge dressing. In a previous post I had asked for advice on fixing a splotchy edge dressing on the natural edge after about a years wear. I was afraid to apply new over the existing, so I sanded them down. I found that 600 grit paper clogged quickly and wasn't very effective. I used some 150 grit paper being careful not to nick the uppers. It took a little time but came out pretty good. I used Chili edge dressing to get the final look. What do you think?

Heel Before:


Heel After:


Side by Side Before/After:


Final Result:

Looks great! How many coats of edge dressing did you use?

 

[PhiPsi32]

Just FYI, I received a response from Paul Grangaard in regards to my MTO request (Thank you, sir.). Looks like he has two people assigned to handle the special requests. I'm very interested to see how the process works and what the customization fees will total up to.

 

[Cold Iron]

Thank you. I hear you on checking for preorders constantly although that whole process has gone by the wayside as of lately.

I have looked at their other shells offerings, I just wish they had some more boot options. I know they can do it, those 721ltd that they made up for Wolverine were a great pair that I really regret passing on.

Yeah there are many of us waiting for shell boots. Normally the new styles come out in the fall however with the worldwide shell shortage will have to wait and see. There are too many shell heads running around these days! ;-)

AE still offers the Dundee which is a chukka. And a man can never have too many shell chukka's IMO:


Although the colors are more limited now. If a suede Dundee comes out in snuff I am all over it.

There is still the Dalton which is a wingtip and a great boot:


It is on the far right, this was in limited edition walnut shell but they are still available in Burgundy (#8) shell. I couldn't fall in love the Wolverine 1K 721 no matter how long I stood there and stared at it. Which was for quite some time LOL. Not sure why I didn't like it, but then again we all have our own preferences. I went with the 1K 744 captoe in Dark Cognac. Here with C&J for RL Marlow wingtip which is also Dark Cognac in between the pair of 744's. I love the color and the boot itself like all 1K boots are more a Heritage work boot. Not something for wear to work but general use. It looks like there are still some available at Leffot: http://leffot.com/shop/wolverine-744-ltd-pre-order/

Fingers crossed that we will get past this shell shortage soon. Although my bank account says it is a good thing there are a few more boots and shoes I would like to pick up to fill in my matrix.

 

[patrick_b]



1. It is rhetoric. Just be glad I didn't call it "BS" or something.

2. Huh? I've been here in this thread for years. Do a search or something. 

You are a douchebag.

 

[tesuquegolfer]



Looks great!  How many coats of edge dressing did you use?

Two coats. I will probably apply occasionally so they hopefully don't get that splotchy look again. If the do I will try the Renomat product I have heard about as that sanding process was time consuming.

 

[Close Hoarse]

OK, so that's twice you make inflammatory remarks about AE in an appreciation forum. Paul was kind enough to respond to you, and you repay that with calling it "rhetoric"? Even if you don't agree with his points, you should still be polite, as he was to you. The thrust of Allen Edmonds is "The Great American Shoe Company." Paul has demonstrated how much of AE contributes to the country both in jobs and supporting industries. Even if components come from somewhere else, they are all assembled in the US, and thus qualify as American to me. Show some respect.

What a non-issue. It would be almost impossible to state how little I care about the exact place of manufacture of every part of an AE shoe, or AE's exact manner of disclosure of those places. There are laws governing truth in advertising. If anyone on this forum has an issue with AE's methods, the proper forum to express their displeasure is with the authorities, not on this forum. In the meantime, Allen Edmonds will continue to be my main source for quality products at reasonable prices.

CH

 

[PaulGrangaardCR]



Paul,

I would say that I reasonably differ with this assessment. I own tons of AEs, but I think that the question is whether the step that is being done in the DR is a significant part of the construction or not. Does the rubber for the heel or the leather have to be made in the US? No.

In this case, though, the part being done in the DR *is* very important. We're talking about intricately designed, brogued, neatly stitched shoes. Now, the DR factory, I gather, does a very fine job of this, and I love my AEs (most in seconds quality) and I think the value trade-off is absolutely acceptable for AE, on a corporate level and a quality level. No complaints from me on the actual decision to do this. But that is a very significant step being done in the DR, even if they're not remotely close to being wearable..

I don't consider a pair of brogued wingtips that had their uppers made in the DR to be made in the USA. I do consider AE as a great american company, with top notch support, great prices and wonderful construction. I will still buy AEs as high quality shoes. But the place of construction is, in my opinion, *not* properly represented.

Added: Paul's response on this thread read like a marketing statement. One line dismissing the question, one stating that this part of the construction is insignificant, and then paragraphs pitching the golf line, the march madness webgem, locations of their stores, US Presidents, patriotism and the can-do spirit of American industrialism. He defended the use of the Made in Italy shoes, and the labeled "Made in DR "shoes. But he ignored the central question of whether the Made in USA shoes should be considered Made in USA. He is friendly, responsive, has great product initiatives, and also the CEO of a major company. He has responsibilities, and I'd be surprised if he gave a response that actually addressed a controversial question such as this.

Gentlemen --

I really don't mind being challenged and, as I said in my long post, reasonable men can differ. However, as wdahab said above, I do have a day job and limited time for posting during the week. So, this time more briefly...

I definitiely did not intend to suggest that upper-making isn't important. It's absolutely crucial to our quality that it is done extremely well. Both of our plants are great at the task, and it isn't an easy job. It takes fantastic fine motor skills and it's the beginning of the entire handcrafted process on that part of the shoe. It just doesn't result in a shoe, not anywhere close to one. That metamorphosis happens entirely here in Port Washington. As for the transparency, this is one of multiple times I've addressed these questions openly. Putting "Made in USA of Fine Imported Leathers, Sometimes European or Brazilian Rubber Soles, Often but Not Always with the Upper Cut and Sewn in the DR and Everything Else Done in the USA" seems too longwinded for the inside of a shoe...even to me. As has been noted previously, we don't yet have a system to track when we use Horween leathers (and we're purposely using more of them all the time) and sew the uppers all in Wisconsin. We still use the "of Fine Imported Leathers" wording for the sake of streamlining the stamping process and making sure we're not wrong, even when it's a Horween with the upper sewn in Port Washington. We're going to work on that one, and Skip Horween is eager for us to do so. So am I, but there are systems requirments ahead of it in our capex budget.

MediaHound's issue (it wasn't a question) that I addressed directly, at least I intended to, was whether calling ourselves The Great American Shoe Company is "disingenuous". That my response sounded like a marketing statement is something I can't argue with. That it seemed like a long string of "American patriotism" is another point I'd agree with... gladly. Believe me, there's a lot more we could have added about how we think (you can disagree) we're "going above and beyond" and deserve that moniker. We're proud of what we're doing here and how it's rejuvenating not just our company but also employment in a formerly robust U.S. manufacturing county.

Less than 1.5% of the shoes bought in the U.S. these days were made in the USA at any steps along the way (according to the American Footwear and Apparel Association's data). We've bucked a multi-decade megatrend and we're glad we did. I would think you guys would be, too, especially because we've done so without charging another $100 (or, depending on the style, much more) for the same shoes made out of the same leathers. As I read these posts, pricing seems to be almost as important as quality when it comes to purchase decisions. So, in the vernacular.... that's how we roll.

Back to work.... Thanks.
Paul

 

[harlequin782]

I'm reading a ton of rhetoric in your post with very little addressing of the point of: why do you talk so much about your USA plant all over your website, yet so little about your DR plant on your website/blogs? Especially if the DR plant is something you are proud of?

I even looked through all of your press releases going back to 2003 here: http://www.allenedmonds.com/aeonline/PressReleasesView?langId=-1&storeId=1&catalogId=40000000001

I see zero mention of your Dominican Republic plant at all. You didn't even do a press release for it's opening in 2007...

This guy here needs to cool it or get banned. Its not even about whether anyone likes or dislikes, or favors or disfavors Allen Edmonds. It has become abundantly clear that he's whining about something that has already been addressed numerous times which is resulting in him talking in circles at this point. And it seems as though repeating the same thing several times has the effect of making a startling new revelation each time he does so, in his mind. Its getting ridiculous. At some point you have to just think for yourself and quit waiting to be spoonfed an apology for what you perceive to be dubious business practices. An inability to do so, in my eyes suggests either a stubborn opposition to reason, or an ignorance to the fallacy of your points that have been addressed time and time again. Perhaps not in the tone of appeasement you'd prefer, but they absolutely have been addressed before AND after your grievance was posted here.

I say this because common sense should tell us at this point that the reason the words "Mediocre, Mostly American Shoe Company With a Slim Minority Of Craftsmanship Completed In the Dominican Republic" dont appear on the website is because that is not the breadth of their source of production. The majority of styles arent even made in the Dominican Republic, and even the one's that are, have the materials shipped from the U.S.

And to be honest, I dont know if Im the only one who already knew this or who remembers this but this Paul guy openly and very transparently said MONTHS AGO that the line of shoes made entirely in the Dominican Republic are very clearly labeled AE rather than Allen Edmonds. He outlined the exact reason for its separate namesake and where those shoes are manufactured. And now in an effort to play "gotcha" sensationalist, we've got some wannabe whistleblower guy drudging up the same exact information that was openly and transparently stated AND REHASHED months ago, and pasting an exclamation mark at the end of it as if he's made a breakthrough discovery for the Enquirer or TMZ. It isnt even a newsworthy revelation at this point. It is the very definition of whining. He's been told what is happening, he's been given the reason it is happening, and rather than accepting either, he goes fishing around for more exposes to publicize that do nothing more than restate what has already been openly discussed. Thats like someone running around squawking about water not being naturally blue, and then everytime someone points out that thats already been discovered by everyone, the person harps on the fact that Aquafina hasnt drawn attention to that information on its website. It starts to look silly after a while.

 

[PaulGrangaardCR]



Just saw this.... I think I understand it and it cracked me up.

 

[wgiceman]



Gentlemen --

I really don't mind being challenged and, as I said in my long post, reasonable men can differ. However, as wdahab said above, I do have a day job and limited time for posting during the week. So, this time more briefly...

I definitiely did not intend to suggest that upper-making isn't important. It's absolutely crucial to our quality that it is done extremely well. Both of our plants are great at the task, and it isn't an easy job. It takes fantastic fine motor skills and it's the beginning of the entire handcrafted process on that part of the shoe. It just doesn't result in a shoe, not anywhere close to one. That metamorphosis happens entirely here in Port Washington. As for the transparency, this is one of multiple times I've addressed these questions openly. Putting "Made in USA of Fine Imported Leathers, Sometimes European or Brazilian Rubber Soles, Often but Not Always with the Upper Cut and Sewn in the DR and Everything Else Done in the USA" seems too longwinded for the inside of a shoe...even to me. As has been noted previously, we don't yet have a system to track when we use Horween leathers (and we're purposely using more of them all the time) and sew the uppers all in Wisconsin. We still use the "of Fine Imported Leathers" wording for the sake of streamlining the stamping process and making sure we're not wrong, even when it's a Horween with the upper sewn in Port Washington. We're going to work on that one, and Skip Horween is eager for us to do so. So am I, but there are systems requirments ahead of it in our capex budget.

MediaHound's issue (it wasn't a question) that I addressed directly, at least I intended to, was whether calling ourselves The Great American Shoe Company is "disingenuous". That my response sounded like a marketing statement is something I can't argue with. That it seemed like a long string of "American patriotism" is another point I'd agree with... gladly. Believe me, there's a lot more we could have added about how we think (you can disagree) we're "going above and beyond" and deserve that moniker. We're proud of what we're doing here and how it's rejuvenating not just our company but also employment in a formerly robust U.S. manufacturing county.

Less than 1.5% of the shoes bought in the U.S. these days were made in the USA at any steps along the way (according to the American Footwear and Apparel Association's data). We've bucked a multi-decade megatrend and we're glad we did. I would think you guys would be, too, especially because we've done so without charging another $100 (or, depending on the style, much more) for the same shoes made out of the same leathers. As I read these posts, pricing seems to be almost as important as quality when it comes to purchase decisions. So, in the vernacular.... that's how we roll.

Back to work.... Thanks.
Paul

the more I hear from Paul, the more I admire AE. I have more than 20 pair and will buy more in the future. I will definitely buy more if Paul can make the custom order happen, as mentioned in his previous post.

 

[kentyman]

I would think you guys would be, too, especially because we've done so without charging another $100 (or, depending on the style, much more) for the same shoes made out of the same leathers. As I read these posts, pricing seems to be almost as important as quality when it comes to purchase decisions. So, in the vernacular.... that's how we roll.

I can personally confirm that value (quality/price) is paramount for my purchasing. Honestly, if your prices weren't so low, I wouldn't be "into" nice shoes. The accessibility of Allen Edmonds shoes is what has allowed me to go from wearing sneakers to work (very laid back office) to being "the guy with the nice shoes". So as they used to say, keep on rollin'...

 

[mediahound]

Gentlemen --

I really don't mind being challenged and, as I said in my long post, reasonable men can differ. However, as wdahab said above, I do have a day job and limited time for posting during the week. So, this time more briefly...

I definitiely did not intend to suggest that upper-making isn't important. It's absolutely crucial to our quality that it is done extremely well. Both of our plants are great at the task, and it isn't an easy job. It takes fantastic fine motor skills and it's the beginning of the entire handcrafted process on that part of the shoe. It just doesn't result in a shoe, not anywhere close to one. That metamorphosis happens entirely here in Port Washington. As for the transparency, this is one of multiple times I've addressed these questions openly. Putting "Made in USA of Fine Imported Leathers, Sometimes European or Brazilian Rubber Soles, Often but Not Always with the Upper Cut and Sewn in the DR and Everything Else Done in the USA" seems too longwinded for the inside of a shoe...even to me. As has been noted previously, we don't yet have a system to track when we use Horween leathers (and we're purposely using more of them all the time) and sew the uppers all in Wisconsin. We still use the "of Fine Imported Leathers" wording for the sake of streamlining the stamping process and making sure we're not wrong, even when it's a Horween with the upper sewn in Port Washington. We're going to work on that one, and Skip Horween is eager for us to do so. So am I, but there are systems requirments ahead of it in our capex budget.

MediaHound's issue (it wasn't a question) that I addressed directly, at least I intended to, was whether calling ourselves The Great American Shoe Company is "disingenuous". That my response sounded like a marketing statement is something I can't argue with. That it seemed like a long string of "American patriotism" is another point I'd agree with... gladly. Believe me, there's a lot more we could have added about how we think (you can disagree) we're "going above and beyond" and deserve that moniker. We're proud of what we're doing here and how it's rejuvenating not just our company but also employment in a formerly robust U.S. manufacturing county.

Less than 1.5% of the shoes bought in the U.S. these days were made in the USA at any steps along the way (according to the American Footwear and Apparel Association's data). We've bucked a multi-decade megatrend and we're glad we did. I would think you guys would be, too, especially because we've done so without charging another $100 (or, depending on the style, much more) for the same shoes made out of the same leathers. As I read these posts, pricing seems to be almost as important as quality when it comes to purchase decisions. So, in the vernacular.... that's how we roll.

Back to work.... Thanks.
Paul

Paul,

If you are proud of what you're doing as you state above, why do you selectively hide what you are doing on your public website such as here?:

http://www.allenedmonds.com/aeonline/PressReleasesView?langId=-1&storeId=1&catalogId=40000000001

Again, you talk a ton about your USA manufacturing all over your site left and right, but nothing on the offshore manufacturing. One would think you are trying to hide it or something.

If you are proud of that fact, why fail mention to it? In the link above, I don't even see a single press release on the DR plant, though I see tons of other press releases on many other (arguably less important) topics like holiday sales, etc.

 

[Scottyb06]

I'm about to buy more pairs myself. I'm going to sell my Hastings (size 11.5D) and my Strands (11.5E) because they simply are the wrong size: I should be in an 11E on the #5 last and don't want to keep these two pair around much longer (I've only worn each about six times each). I know I'll lose some money on them, despite purchasing them as seconds, but think it's the right move over the longer term. I have a pair of Bourbon McAllister's coming (11E) and look forward to replacing the other pairs (likely a pair of Strands in Walnut and a pair of Neumoks). Thinking about passing on black for now...

 

[PaulGrangaardCR]



1)  Paul, is this the only forum you participate on?  And is this the only thread/topic you can be found in?

I remain a devoted customer with AE, starting many years ago when I made my first purchase at Nordstroms for a perfect fit.  But with last night's purchase at your web site, I was asked to complete an online AE survey, in which it asked for improvements.  The main improvement I listed was the ability to interact with AE (either at the AE site or here) so that we can pose questions about AE products, services, maintenance, and styles without going through the email or phone method.

2)  I did not know about the DR line you offer, so I took a peek just now and was AMAZED to see a DR shoe design that I can no longer get (the Sanford) titled "The Oxford".  But when I clicked the DR oxford, I was dismayed to see the shoe has rubber tires on the soles (which probably serves a great need for those who wish it).  I would have snapped them up if they had the traditional famous leather AE soles and heal - but it was not to be.  And the Strand Last is quite different than the Sanford Last.  (When my Sanfords needed replacement and AE no longer offered the Sanford, I was sold a Lexington - which I have grown to dislike over the years).

Your AE website still carries the AE official review on the Sanford (which confuses me even more in that - if the Sanford was so popular in sales, then why discontinue it?):

[COLOR=0000FF]AE Quote:[/COLOR]


"Sanford - Cap-toe Lace-up Oxford Men's Dress Shoes by Allen Edmonds.
 
"This shoe is a closeout style, and is therefore limited to the sizes and widths that are currently available online. 
 
"Believe it or not, once and a while even we make mistakes - like discontinuing this shoe after offering it for more than 15 years. But thanks to our loyal customers, who asked for its return more than any other shoe, we brought back this classic in 2010 and now it is more popular than ever. 
 
"The high demand is no doubt a result of combining its more versitile blucher style with the business-ready brogue detail and a dressed up cap-toe. Comfort also plays a big role in its success given that we designed this model to fit a little bit wider through the ball of the foot - meaning the Sanford ideally suits broader feet or ones with higher insteps or arches. 
 
"So there you have it: versatile style plus comfort equals a shoe that is close to perfect, even if we aren't. Click any link below to view similar styles: Leather sole men's lace-up oxford dress shoes Cap-toe blucher with brogue perforations and medallion Part of the ' Timeless Classics Collection' of premium men's shoes Lined premium calfskin leather upper Single oak leather sole 360 degree Goodyear welted construction."
 
3)  With the much talked about Saphir polish and maintenance products (using mink oil and other outstanding ingredients to get a far more superior masked shoe shine to return the look of the shoes to the original out-of-the-box quality), will AE be considering upgrading their polish products in this regard?  (When I called AE support they knew nothing about the Saphir line, even though it is becoming quite the recommended product above all else)
 
Thank you for serving us as the CEO for Allen Edmonds, which carries the weight of many considerations,
 
David Copeland 

David -

We have Facebook and Twitter sites. Someday I hope to have an interactive Forum on our website, but that's a ways into the future. We do have the ability to post reviews on our products, though, and we reply to those directly, which is active dialogue.

I'm not sure what you'd like with respect to the Sanford. We had to re-order the cutting dies for that shoe to re-introduce it -- as the originals had been lost. So, we're more than willing to use them again. Please send me your phone number and I'll have our newly-constituted StyleForum SWAT Team call you directly, if you'd like.

Paul