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Allen Edmonds Appreciation Thread - Page 1268

post #19006 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdmcallister View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by frogwash View Post

I don't recall for what magazine that was shot , but I do remember that it did say Black Calf Leeds.
Judging by the GQ in the bottom left corner of the pic I'd say it was shot for Home and Garden
fight%5B1%5D.gif


facepalm.gif
post #19007 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by helius0 View Post

That is a very serious charge to make against any manufacturer.

If you truly believe AE is fudging their "made in USA" labels, you should file a complaint with the Federal Trade Commissions.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmdsimpson View Post

Mediahound, this is not news. They freely admit to this manufacturing and have been doing it for a while.


They have:

- Wholly made in the DR shoes: the "ae" line

- Uppers made in the DR and the rest of the shoes assembled in the US: Various shoes. They actually move production between the DR and the US depending on needs.

- Wholly made in the US shoes: shell cordovan and possibly the Independence line (not sure about the latter)


They divulge full information and are wholly upfront about this in all their materials. Yes, the shoes say "Made in the USA", but they are allowed to by law.

I however disagree that:

"They divulge full information and are wholly upfront about this in all their materials." 

Unbelievable. You're quoting someone else's inaccurate paraphrasing as your "source"?

Why don't you go read Mr. Grangaard's response instead of continuing with your and others' bullshit. Production does NOT move back and forth between here and there.

http://www.styleforum.net/t/228354/are-all-allen-edmonds-uppers-made-in-the-dominican-republic/30_30#post_5390098
post #19008 of 46993

just noticed the 2013 catalog is up

http://www.allenedmondsdigital.com/publication?i=151736

post #19009 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by zchen View Post

just noticed the 2013 catalog is up
http://www.allenedmondsdigital.com/publication?i=151736

No sign of new dress boots shog[1].gif
post #19010 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by frogwash View Post

Unbelievable. You're quoting someone else's inaccurate paraphrasing as your "source"?

Why don't you go read Mr. Grangaard's response instead of continuing with your and others' bullshit. Production does NOT move back and forth between here and there.

http://www.styleforum.net/t/228354/are-all-allen-edmonds-uppers-made-in-the-dominican-republic/30_30#post_5390098

If you read Mr. Grangaard's reply, it is clear that production on the first part (cutting and sewing the uppers) moves back and forth. The first part is done in either the Dominican Republic or in Wisconsin. But the remaining part, after the upper is done, is done entirely in Wisconsin:
Quote:
Thanks for your feedback. We do indeed have duplicative capabilities at the beginning of the shoemaking process in Wisconsin and, since 2006, in the Dominican Republic. Both plants are 100% owned and managed closely by us, staffed by our employees. If you watch our YouTube Plant Tour video (available on our website home page), the part of the Goodyear welt process that's also done in the DR is the cutting of the upper leathers, sewing of those pieces together and "hanging" of the lining. The resulting work-in-process looks like a flattened baseball cap with a large hole in the top and no sewn seams around the brim or the bottom of the cap.

The lining and the unfinished upper are attached together and to the bottom of the shoe in the lasting and welting processes, which are all done in Wisconsin. The footbed (inside bottom) leather cutting and the welt taping for the sides and bottoms of the shoes are done 100% in Port Washington, as is the rest of the production process -- the shaping of the loose uppers in preparation for lasting, insertion of toeboxes and heel counters, lasting, attaching the footbed, welting, hot corking, sewing on the sole, nailing and gluing on the heel base, attaching the heel "toplift", trimming all the edges, wheeling, cutting, trimming and attaching the sock liner (when used), and all the stages of finishing. How the duplicated work on the uppers gets distributed between the two plants depends on order flows from week to week.

Edited by Septimus - 4/18/13 at 3:34am
post #19011 of 46993
I finally got to wear my web gem Neumoks today!!
post #19012 of 46993
I finally got to wear my web gem Neumoks today!!
post #19013 of 46993
I finally got to wear my web gem Neumoks today!!
post #19014 of 46993
I finally got to wear my web gem Neumoks today!!
post #19015 of 46993

Those are nice all 4 times, haha.  Good looking shoe

post #19016 of 46993

Sorry about that fellas! My phone went nuts!!

post #19017 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post

I however disagree that:

"They divulge full information and are wholly upfront about this in all their materials." 

Quote:
Originally Posted by frogwash View Post

Unbelievable. You're quoting someone else's inaccurate paraphrasing as your "source"?

Why don't you go read Mr. Grangaard's response instead of continuing with your and others' bullshit. Production does NOT move back and forth between here and there.

http://www.styleforum.net/t/228354/are-all-allen-edmonds-uppers-made-in-the-dominican-republic/30_30#post_5390098


Mediahound, you caught me. I wrote that statement before I went back to their website to see what they say there. I was aware of the quote cited by Frogwash, however, and I had in my mind that they have been open about the situation. Also, whether correctly or not, I have taken the "made of fine imported leather" printed prominently inside every shoe to include assembled uppers from the DR.

I want to be careful to not sound like an AE cheerleader here, but I want to explain why you are getting the reaction you have to your statements.

You are technically correct. Some portion of Allen Edmonds' shoes are made in the DR, and it is not prominently disclosed on their website, although as I said above, it could be taken to be disclosed inside the shoe. The issue I had with your initial post - and still disagree with you on - is the alarmist tone of your statements. First, as I said, this is old news here. I don't mean this to be flippant; rather that this is a forum of Allen Edmonds enthusiasts (of which you are one), and this topic has been discussed several times before. People here already know about this and have already decided how they feel about it.

Your other point is the use of the tagline "The Great Shoe American Shoe Company", which you find to be disingenuous. Again, I think this is a technical argument, and most have already decided what they feel.

Now, you are free to "boycott" AE if you choose, and to find another shoe manufacturer whose marketing and production you agree with (and in fact, there was a post earlier of someone who implied that they would stop buying AE based on your posts).

But here are the reasons why I think people are sticking with AE:

- Obviously, they are not breaking any laws. The content of their shoes labeled Made in the USA meet requirements

- Other "American" companies have a portion of their products made outside the US. The best example might be the auto industry. No car is made of 100% sourced in the USA components - in fact, most are barely over 50%, and this includes our "Great American" auto companies Chrysler (talk about some rah-rah patriotic advertising lately!), GM, and Ford. In fact, Honda, Toyota, and others have Made in the USA cars. Old news, right?

- The materials used in fine shoes are often sourced elsewhere, including the main material, leather. This is usually regarded as a plus, as someone stated earlier. And it works the other way, too - C&J, a fine "Made in England" shoe maker, uses Horween shell from Chicago. Should they skimp on their shell, because it has to be made in the UK from UK-raised cows? And in this case, AE clearly states that they use imported leather.

--- And actually, here is a funny exception: My Horween shell shoes have the same "made of fine imported leather" stamp on them. However, the Horween shell is American. The soles are German. Someone could easily take this statement to mean that the entire shoe is made of imported leather, which would be incorrect.

- There is a realism from people that this situation is a compromise to keep the price of AE's shoes in the $300 range. If there were no DR factory and everything had to made in the US, then we all assume prices would go up.

- Their CEO has been forthcoming with the DR production in interviews, and so that has satisfied many people here.

I think your issue is really with the "Great American Shoe Company" moniker. I think that has different interpretations for people, and you are free to take is as you choose. My point was simply that you have come in here with breaking news, gotten everyone excited, and then told us all something we have already known and processed.
post #19018 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by tampatravel View Post

Sorry about that fellas! My phone went nuts!!

Your phone loves the blue leather!
post #19019 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by zchen View Post

just noticed the 2013 catalog is up

http://www.allenedmondsdigital.com/publication?i=151736

 

Is there anything new in there?

post #19020 of 46993
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post

This is not nitpicking. The Amok uppers are cut and sewn not in the USA. 

 

Further, AE has a duplicate plant in the DR and shifts production on 'Made in USA' shoes there at any time. But the Amoks even say 'Made from fine imported leather' on them. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by kmdsimpson View Post



Mediahound, you caught me. I wrote that statement before I went back to their website to see what they say there. I was aware of the quote cited by Frogwash, however, and I had in my mind that they have been open about the situation. Also, whether correctly or not, I have taken the "made of fine imported leather" printed prominently inside every shoe to include assembled uppers from the DR.

I want to be careful to not sound like an AE cheerleader here, but I want to explain why you are getting the reaction you have to your statements.

You are technically correct. Some portion of Allen Edmonds' shoes are made in the DR, and it is not prominently disclosed on their website, although as I said above, it could be taken to be disclosed inside the shoe. The issue I had with your initial post - and still disagree with you on - is the alarmist tone of your statements. First, as I said, this is old news here. I don't mean this to be flippant; rather that this is a forum of Allen Edmonds enthusiasts (of which you are one), and this topic has been discussed several times before. People here already know about this and have already decided how they feel about it.

Your other point is the use of the tagline "The Great Shoe American Shoe Company", which you find to be disingenuous. Again, I think this is a technical argument, and most have already decided what they feel.

Now, you are free to "boycott" AE if you choose, and to find another shoe manufacturer whose marketing and production you agree with (and in fact, there was a post earlier of someone who implied that they would stop buying AE based on your posts).

But here are the reasons why I think people are sticking with AE:

- Obviously, they are not breaking any laws. The content of their shoes labeled Made in the USA meet requirements

- Other "American" companies have a portion of their products made outside the US. The best example might be the auto industry. No car is made of 100% sourced in the USA components - in fact, most are barely over 50%, and this includes our "Great American" auto companies Chrysler (talk about some rah-rah patriotic advertising lately!), GM, and Ford. In fact, Honda, Toyota, and others have Made in the USA cars. Old news, right?

- The materials used in fine shoes are often sourced elsewhere, including the main material, leather. This is usually regarded as a plus, as someone stated earlier. And it works the other way, too - C&J, a fine "Made in England" shoe maker, uses Horween shell from Chicago. Should they skimp on their shell, because it has to be made in the UK from UK-raised cows? And in this case, AE clearly states that they use imported leather.

--- And actually, here is a funny exception: My Horween shell shoes have the same "made of fine imported leather" stamp on them. However, the Horween shell is American. The soles are German. Someone could easily take this statement to mean that the entire shoe is made of imported leather, which would be incorrect.

- There is a realism from people that this situation is a compromise to keep the price of AE's shoes in the $300 range. If there were no DR factory and everything had to made in the US, then we all assume prices would go up.

- Their CEO has been forthcoming with the DR production in interviews, and so that has satisfied many people here.

I think your issue is really with the "Great American Shoe Company" moniker. I think that has different interpretations for people, and you are free to take is as you choose. My point was simply that you have come in here with breaking news, gotten everyone excited, and then told us all something we have already known and processed.

 

I think kmdsimpson said everything extremely well here, and I agree with all of it.  The "Made of Fine Imported Leather" thing keeps frustrating me, because it keeps coming up.  The label of "Made of Fine Imported Leather" is in no way a nod to the manufactering of shoes in the Dominican Republic.  As kmdsimpson says, ALL of their shoes are now saying this on the insole.  Using imported leather is not new, it is not a degradation of quality, and it doesn't represent a change in their methods.  If you see an AE shoe without this label, it is probably old stock.  It doesn't necessarily mean that it is made of USA sourced leather.  I assure you, Alden shoes (since they are the other prominent American shoe maker) also purchases their hides (other than shell) from tanneries from other countries as well, just as all of the fine English shoemakers of Northampton do.  Making a product from the best available materials frequently requires importing goods.  Made in USA means alot to us from a quality and patriotic standpoint, but that doesn't mean that the USA produces the the highest quality natural materials all the time.  If your country produces the best of a particular type of natural resource or material, it is often luck rather than human effort due to climate, geography, landscape, etc. 

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