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Allen Edmonds Appreciation Thread - reviews, pictures, sizing, etc... - Page 4260  

post #63886 of 70737

I don't believe AE is worth full retail, but on sale, they are quite a steal.

 

I got my pa, strand, and mcallisters for $258 each... my wide belts for 60 each.

 

I definitely think those prices are well worth the quality im getting

post #63887 of 70737
@harlequin782 Totally no joke, I read your two longer posts right before going to sleep last night (and after way too much cab, not opus 😊), and I had a nightmare I was presenting to our customers at work and my PA heels disintegrated when I was walking. Gotta be careful what you read before bed.
post #63888 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by peppercorn78 View Post

The heels of my McTavish have worn down, and it's definitely some type of paperboard underneath. I'll take a photo tonight when I'm home. The heel stiffener is celastic, I believe, and the toe stiffener in calf models is paperboard, I think.

Yeah, it irks me too when folks compare Carmina to AE. They're only comparably priced due to a fluke of currency fluctuations. It's easily a much higher end shoe.

Also labor and associated business costs in Spain are not comparable to USA.

I definitely see your point...the only reason I mention Carmina is because that actually is the brand to which Ive been directed several times now, whenever questions about quality AE alternatives arise...whatever the reason their prices are comparable to AE's right now, I've noticed they are the go to recommendation for quality alternatives even more frequently than AE's own higher quality Independence line.

Correct me if Im wrong, but what you seem to be saying here is that even though Allen Edmonds has seemingly begun cutting corners and reduced the quality of its product in doing so, all while raising their prices, the fact that Carminas can be had for a comparable price is acceptable because it can be attributed to some trade exchange disparity, while at the same time disregarding the equally true fact that it is also due to the fact that AE's have actually raised their prices to the point that they have abutted the price point of a far superior product?..

I'm more or less just bitching about my disappointment with AE at this point, not so much disagreeing or trying to discredit your statement...it just seems like the issue hasn't been brought to AE's attention or it gets swept under the rug every time it is.
post #63889 of 70737
I actually said a lot of the same things as harlequin to an SA a few months ago...she basically said everyone on SF was a moron who has no idea what they are talking about, that leather costs have gone up, that no one has any idea what it means to be on the "other side if the table" meaning not the consumer. What a power trip - and quite a way to sell shoes to a customer. Good thing she was cute 😊
post #63890 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by harlequin782 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by peppercorn78 View Post

The heels of my McTavish have worn down, and it's definitely some type of paperboard underneath. I'll take a photo tonight when I'm home. The heel stiffener is celastic, I believe, and the toe stiffener in calf models is paperboard, I think.

Yeah, it irks me too when folks compare Carmina to AE. They're only comparably priced due to a fluke of currency fluctuations. It's easily a much higher end shoe.

Also labor and associated business costs in Spain are not comparable to USA.

I definitely see your point...the only reason I mention Carmina is because that actually is the brand to which Ive been directed several times now, whenever questions about quality AE alternatives arise...whatever the reason their prices are comparable to AE's right now, I've noticed they are the go to recommendation for quality alternatives even more frequently than AE's own higher quality Independence line.

Correct me if Im wrong, but what you seem to be saying here is that even though Allen Edmonds has seemingly begun cutting corners and reduced the quality of its product in doing so, all while raising their prices, the fact that Carminas can be had for a comparable price is acceptable because it can be attributed to some trade exchange disparity, while at the same time disregarding the equally true fact that it is also due to the fact that AE's have actually raised their prices to the point that they have abutted the price point of a far superior product?..

I'm more or less just bitching about my disappointment with AE at this point, not so much disagreeing or trying to discredit your statement...it just seems like the issue hasn't been brought to AE's attention or it gets swept under the rug every time it is.

Well I for one am very disappointed that the heel issue seems to be accurate and both shoes mentioned are what I would consider to be the main line. I buy AE and Alden as they are made in the USA. I buy Viberg since we'll Canada is basically just another city that is part of the USA.

I am all for making a profit and trimming the fat if you will but not at the expense of key pieces of the final product.
post #63891 of 70737
Is the apparent use of cardboard a new development? There is an interesting "dissection" thread located here:

http://www.styleforum.net/t/415186/shoe-dissection-allen-edmonds-john-lobb-bostonian-and-more

There does not appear to be any sub-par materials being used in the AE sheos in these photos. What am I missing?
post #63892 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by HealthActuary View Post

I don't believe AE is worth full retail, but on sale, they are quite a steal.

I got my pa, strand, and mcallisters for $258 each... my wide belts for 60 each.

I definitely think those prices are well worth the quality im getting
yes, I do believe AE seconds or sale are a great buy max 250 rang, not more than that. And I do think paying north 400 for a pair of shoes with decrease leather quality and cardboard heels is overpriced.

Yes, I know the dollar -euro fluctuations influence the pricing at the moment, but we still get a chance to buy better quality shoes at this price range at the moment.

Regarding, the Spanish vs US labor thing, you are incorrect about this, because all the uppers are made in Dominican Republic. Half of the shoes (uppers) are made my cheap slave labor in DR, which is a 3rd world island country 80% of the people there live on minimum wage or under. So even in labor there are cutting corners and still charging absurd prices.
post #63893 of 70737
Guys quick question about AE sizing.

Is a 8E wider than a 7.5 EEE?

I have a pair of walden in 7.5 EEE and it's still snug in the middle. Toe is bit snug but ok but the main body of the foot is tight in the middle.

Seeing that there isn't anything wider than EEE, I was thinking of sizing up to either an 8E or 8EE or even possibly an 8EEE. Is there a general rule of thumb?

In case it's shoe specific, I'm looking at purchasing the Cavanaugh loafer and the Grayson loafer. As mentioned, 7.5 EEE is too narrow but the length is good. Any recommendations on which size would work best?

Cheers
post #63894 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by vmss View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by HealthActuary View Post

I don't believe AE is worth full retail, but on sale, they are quite a steal.

I got my pa, strand, and mcallisters for $258 each... my wide belts for 60 each.

I definitely think those prices are well worth the quality im getting
yes, I do believe AE seconds or sale are a great buy max 250 rang, not more than that. And I do think paying north 400 for a pair of shoes with decrease leather quality and cardboard heels is overpriced.

Yes, I know the dollar -euro fluctuations influence the pricing at the moment, but we still get a chance to buy better quality shoes at this price range at the moment.

Regarding, the Spanish vs US labor thing, you are incorrect about this, because all the uppers are made in Dominican Republic. Half of the shoes (uppers) are made my cheap slave labor in DR, which is a 3rd world island country 80% of the people there live on minimum wage or under. So even in labor there are cutting corners and still charging absurd prices.

I thought they were just cut or clicked in the dr, are you saying all the stitching is done there too? That is news to me also, that too would be disappointing. I was also under the idea that the MTO and Indy lines were done 100 percent in USA. Any idea on that?
post #63895 of 70737
Sorry if this isn't the right place for my question could someone let me know where I should move this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by iloveplaid View Post

Guys quick question about AE sizing.

Is a 8E wider than a 7.5 EEE?

I have a pair of walden in 7.5 EEE and it's still snug in the middle. Toe is bit snug but ok but the main body of the foot is tight in the middle.

Seeing that there isn't anything wider than EEE, I was thinking of sizing up to either an 8E or 8EE or even possibly an 8EEE. Is there a general rule of thumb?

In case it's shoe specific, I'm looking at purchasing the Cavanaugh loafer and the Grayson loafer. As mentioned, 7.5 EEE is too narrow but the length is good. Any recommendations on which size would work best?

Cheers
post #63896 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kahuna75 View Post

I thought they were just cut or clicked in the dr, are you saying all the stitching is done there too? That is news to me also, that too would be disappointing. I was also under the idea that the MTO and Indy lines were done 100 percent in USA. Any idea on that?

The uppers arrive stitched to Wisconsin, someone correct me if I am wrong. They use the same assembly approach as Meermin. Meermin also has their uppers and maybe certain parts of the shoes in China and finishing touches in Mallorca, Spain.

Dunno about the Indy lines. I have the Harrison and I do find their leather quality comparible to Carmina. They have a nice touch to it. The leathers of the main lines are definitely inferior. It looks that even the Harrison Indy line uses cardboard heel as well. Dunno where they are made I believe the same as the timeless collection.
post #63897 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo1 View Post

@harlequin782 Totally no joke, I read your two longer posts right before going to sleep last night (and after way too much cab, not opus 😊), and I had a nightmare I was presenting to our customers at work and my PA heels disintegrated when I was walking. Gotta be careful what you read before bed.

Lol look what my mother in law brought over...great timing
post #63898 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by vmss View Post


The uppers arrive stitched to Wisconsin, someone correct me if I am wrong. They use the same assembly approach as Meermin. Meermin also has their uppers and maybe certain parts of the shoes in China and finishing touches in Mallorca, Spain.

Dunno about the Indy lines. I have the Harrison and I do find their leather quality comparible to Carmina. They have a nice touch to it. The leathers of the main lines are definitely inferior. It looks that even the Harrison Indy line uses cardboard heel as well. Dunno where they are made I believe the same as the timeless collection.

 

I don't think you're entirely 100% informed correctly. 

post #63899 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by garland View Post

I don't think you're entirely 100% informed correctly. 
Please read the following quote from the Allen Edmonds wiki page "Dominican Republic manufacturing


"In 2006, concerned with rising manufacturing costs and looking to compete more directly with the boat shoe and handsewn market, Allen Edmonds made the decision to discontinue their Lewiston, Maine manufacturing and moved the handsewn production to their new, company owned, factory in the Dominican Republic.[11] Currently shoe uppers for the Allen Edmonds handsewn collection are cut and sewn in the Dominican Republic .[12] The raw materials are sent there from the U.S., where the uppers are sewn together, then shipped back to the factory in Port Washington, Wisconsin, to complete their construction, thus allowing them to be considered "Made in the USA." Alternatively, styles from the ae by Allen Edmonds collection are produced entirely in and sold as Made in the Dominican Republic. In addition to their handsewn collection, Allen Edmonds also utilizes the Dominican Republic factory to cut and sew the uppers of their Goodyear welted collection of shoes. Similar to the "American Made" handsewns, these welted uppers are shipped back to the factory in Wisconsin where the remainder of the lasting, welting and soling are completed." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen_Edmonds

According to the wiki of Allen Edmonds the uppers are sewn in Dominican Republic. The attachment of the sole welting and finishing touches are done in the US. Very similar to Meermin approach.
Edited by vmss - 9/19/15 at 4:50pm
post #63900 of 70737
I'd be really intrigued to know if the mainline models now have the cardboard heel. The Neumok and McTavish are lower priced models ($300/$275 often on sale v. $385) so to an extent you might call it justifiable. I still wouldn't, but they could argue that's what you get for a lower price. On the other hand if the Strand, PA or any of the $385 shoes have the cardboard heel, that is pretty outrageous. 

 

RE: main collection being made in DR, I'm pretty confident that's false and only the handsewn/AE are made there. You'll notice that the Wiki paragraph doesn't provide any source for the proposition that the mainline is made overseas, unlike for the handsewns. Also, as late as 2010 Allen Edmonds advertised that it was still cutting/assembling the uppers in WI. Source (if you're gonna trust an advertising video, for what it's worth): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVihz2DbPd8


Edited by antb29 - 9/19/15 at 5:02pm
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