or Connect
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Classic Menswear › Allen Edmonds Appreciation Thread - reviews, pictures, sizing, etc...
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Allen Edmonds Appreciation Thread - reviews, pictures, sizing, etc... - Page 2043  

post #30631 of 70737

So it appears that they are out of the most desired colors of shell cordovan, leaving only the standard brown, burgundy and black. So here is my question to the SF readers. I am interested in getting a monk strap, I am thinking I want burgundy shell. Do I get the Franciscan or the Mora. I saw a while back a guy had the franciscan made up as an independence with wheeling and everything. Looks pretty hot to me. What say you guys??? Brown or Burgundy shell, and Franciscan or Mora?

 

post #30632 of 70737
Mora, I really don't care for the 3 last. I too wanted a capp. Mora but he who hesitates gets no cordovan.
post #30633 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by wurger View Post


yes, correctly pointed out, selling seconds at a discounted rate for me does not lessen the appeal of the brand, instead I see this as an extremely effective method of moving unwanted stock, and AE is very clear to the point that those are seconds.

As for the AE first sales, as MWS stated, it happens at strategic times of the year for certain styles and lines.

 

 

I don't think anyone would dispute that it is an effective method of moving unwanted stock, but I do think that the higher up the premium chain one ascends, the greater the risk of some degree of brand tarnishing.  There is a reason that you don't see defective Lobb or Edward Green shoes offered for sale as "seconds".  If the shoe doesn't meet their standards, it doesn't bear their name.  Period.  That communicates something to the consumer.  And yes, I know that those brands are a good deal north of AE in price, but then again you don't see sloppily-made  Carminas being dumped on the market at half price, and bearing the Carmina brand name, either.  And Carmina are not so very far away from AE.

 

I suppose the question rests on where AE wants to be as a brand (as distinct from a business) and how they want their brand to be perceived.  Practices such as sale-of-the-day marketing and selling defective shoes bearing the same brand name as mainline shoes don't enhance the brand name within a premium context - though they may very well prove to be a successful and profitable approach to running a business.  WalMart is successful and profitable.

 

Finally, I am not sure that these two propositions can comfortably co-exist: 1) That the general public is largely unaware of the endless sales, notwithstanding that they are prominently displayed on the web site and directly communicated by e-mail, and 2) the public is very much aware of the difference between seconds and mainline shoes, such that deep discounting of the former will not impact their appreciation of the latter.

 

Anyway, I do appreciate those who have shared their thoughts on the matter.

post #30634 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by GOP Shoe Guy View Post

So it appears that they are out of the most desired colors of shell cordovan, leaving only the standard brown, burgundy and black. So here is my question to the SF readers. I am interested in getting a monk strap, I am thinking I want burgundy shell. Do I get the Franciscan or the Mora. I saw a while back a guy had the franciscan made up as an independence with wheeling and everything. Looks pretty hot to me. What say you guys??? Brown or Burgundy shell, and Franciscan or Mora?



What color are the MacNeil that you posted/received a few weeks ago?
post #30635 of 70737
Doesn't EG and JL do factory sales once or twice year? dont' know if they are seconds?

Roger, I agree with everything you say; but to be honest, I didn't even know about second sales until I started posting on this thread, and when I first purchased AE, I looked at the main site and a few big vendors like amazon and nordstrom, and not many people is going to bother to go through pages of forums for a pair of shoes, most people buy shoes when they need them or their old pair came to the end of its life, a few wait for the cyclic sales that every shoemaker has, including the high ends.

I guess the fact this thread has somewhat moved from AE appreciation to AE sales and discounts information, affected our views on how much the constant second sales is going to change the image of the company.
post #30636 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamAdam View Post


What color are the MacNeil that you posted/received a few weeks ago?

I believe they're walnut shell cordovan, which AE is out of. 

post #30637 of 70737

Today only you can get 25% off almost everything, including Allen Edmonds, at Jos. A. Bank.  This is a very rare promotion.  They almost always exclude AE from their coupon codes.  To redeem online use code EXTRA25.

post #30638 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by wurger View Post


I guess the fact this thread has somewhat moved from AE appreciation to AE sales and discounts information,


^^This. Mostly new members and pictures of new shoes and quoted 3 times on the same page !
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerP View Post


  And Carmina are not so very far away from AE.


Are you kidding ?

Carmina is way way better than AE. Carmina is a premium product where as AE is mass produced. Carmina has more elegant lasts, channeled soles, perfect finishing and better leather quality. Don't get me wrong I have 12+ pairs of AE and only 2 pairs of Carminas. AE finishing is a joke. I have few AE first quality shoes and they are same a my seconds - we all know why. With all the constant seconds sale , I wonder if AE is actually selling their inventory at a cheaper price and calling them second (ae first or second no difference at all anyway). Maybe the Seconds are just smoke and mirrors. And if AE can sell shoes for $125-$150 and still make a profit - guess whats the real worth of the product (meaning the quality of leather and such) .
Bottom line members on this thread including ME are looking for cheap shoes - that are classically styled and made(goodyear welted) . If we are to expect elegant lasts , high quality calf skin or quality finishing / antiquing we will have to look else where and pay double.
post #30639 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJTraveler View Post
 

Today only you can get 25% off almost everything, including Allen Edmonds, at Jos. A. Bank.  This is a very rare promotion.  They almost always exclude AE from their coupon codes.  To redeem online use code EXTRA25.

 

If I am willing to pay the shipping I don't know why they continue to do this:

post #30640 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by md2010 View Post


^^This. Mostly new members and pictures of new shoes and quoted 3 times on the same page !
Are you kidding ?

Carmina is way way better than AE. Carmina is a premium product where as AE is mass produced. Carmina has more elegant lasts, channeled soles, perfect finishing and better leather quality. Don't get me wrong I have 12+ pairs of AE and only 2 pairs of Carminas. AE finishing is a joke. I have few AE first quality shoes and they are same a my seconds - we all know why. With all the constant seconds sale , I wonder if AE is actually selling their inventory at a cheaper price and calling them second (ae first or second no difference at all anyway). Maybe the Seconds are just smoke and mirrors. And if AE can sell shoes for $125-$150 and still make a profit - guess whats the real worth of the product (meaning the quality of leather and such) .
Bottom line members on this thread including ME are looking for cheap shoes - that are classically styled and made(goodyear welted) . If we are to expect elegant lasts , high quality calf skin or quality finishing / antiquing we will have to look else where and pay double.

 

I think Roger was saying that Carmina isn't very far away from AE in price, not quality of finishing.

post #30641 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoneyWellSpent View Post
 

 

I think Roger was saying that Carmina isn't very far away from AE in price, not quality of finishing.

 

Correct. 

post #30642 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerP View Post
 

 

 

I don't think anyone would dispute that it is an effective method of moving unwanted stock, but I do think that the higher up the premium chain one ascends, the greater the risk of some degree of brand tarnishing.  There is a reason that you don't see defective Lobb or Edward Green shoes offered for sale as "seconds".  If the shoe doesn't meet their standards, it doesn't bear their name.  Period.  That communicates something to the consumer.  And yes, I know that those brands are a good deal north of AE in price, but then again you don't see sloppily-made  Carminas being dumped on the market at half price, and bearing the Carmina brand name, either.  And Carmina are not so very far away from AE.

 

I suppose the question rests on where AE wants to be as a brand (as distinct from a business) and how they want their brand to be perceived.  Practices such as sale-of-the-day marketing and selling defective shoes bearing the same brand name as mainline shoes don't enhance the brand name within a premium context - though they may very well prove to be a successful and profitable approach to running a business.  WalMart is successful and profitable.

 

Finally, I am not sure that these two propositions can comfortably co-exist: 1) That the general public is largely unaware of the endless sales, notwithstanding that they are prominently displayed on the web site and directly communicated by e-mail, and 2) the public is very much aware of the difference between seconds and mainline shoes, such that deep discounting of the former will not impact their appreciation of the latter.

 

Anyway, I do appreciate those who have shared their thoughts on the matter.

 

 

I think AE's main goal is to put average men into good quality shoes at prices they can afford.  Shoes that will last for many years, because they are repairable, and they look good.  They are made in the traditional way, the same way your grandpa's and great grandpa's shoes were made, and they support American manufacturing.

 

Paul Grangaard himself said that he doesn't consider their competitors to be Alden, or any of the higher Goodyear-welted manufacturers.  They consider their competition to be the massive, outsourced, fashion forward brands that charge substantially more for their shoes than they are worth (Johnston and Murphy, Cole-Haan, etc.).

 

AE wants to be perceived as affordable quality, not exclusive.  Nowhere in their business model, sales tactics, slogans, etc., do you see any hint of an attempt to be perceived as a luxury frills brand.  They value their grass-roots American heritage of supplying men with quality that lasts.

post #30643 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by wurger View Post

I thought Seconds constitute more than just some visual imperfections on a pair of shoes.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by WICaniac View Post


Often not. I have 2 pairs of seconds (with a 3rd on the way), and I can find nothing wrong in one and discern a slight gouge near the eyelets of the other. My salesman claims that they often cannot identify the flaws of the 2nds they sell.

 

 

I would actually say generally not.  AE doesn't want to sell shoes that are structurally defective.  That's not in their best interest.

 

I won't be so bold as to say that structurally defective shoes never make it through QA, but they should be the exception to the rule.  AE doesn't release every single shoe that passes through the assembly line, relegating them to either the "firsts" or "seconds" bin.  They will remake parts of a shoe that is structurally defective, if possible, before sending it to the shoe bank.  I've seen evidence of that first hand.  If a shoe is blatantly structurally defective, it isn't released at all.

post #30644 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoneyWellSpent View Post


I think AE's main goal is to put average men into good quality shoes at prices they can afford.  Shoes that will last for many years, because they are repairable, and they look good.  They are made in the traditional way, the same way your grandpa's and great grandpa's shoes were made, and they support American manufacturing.

Paul Grangaard himself said that he doesn't consider their competitors to be Alden, or any of the higher Goodyear-welted manufacturers.  They consider their competition to be the massive, outsourced, fashion forward brands that charge substantially more for their shoes than they are worth (Johnston and Murphy, Cole-Haan, etc.).

AE wants to be perceived as affordable quality, not exclusive.  Nowhere in their business model, sales tactics, slogans, etc., do you see any hint of an attempt to be perceived as a luxury frills brand.  They value their grass-roots American heritage of supplying men with quality that lasts.

I agree with you. I think for AE to compete at higher levels they will really need to re structure the whole Independence line. But whether they want to venture into that market or if they have the capacity to do that is the question.
post #30645 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoneyWellSpent View Post


I think AE's main goal is to put average men into good quality shoes at prices they can afford.  Shoes that will last for many years, because they are repairable, and they look good.  They are made in the traditional way, the same way your grandpa's and great grandpa's shoes were made, and they support American manufacturing.

Paul Grangaard himself said that he doesn't consider their competitors to be Alden, or any of the higher Goodyear-welted manufacturers.  They consider their competition to be the massive, outsourced, fashion forward brands that charge substantially more for their shoes than they are worth (Johnston and Murphy, Cole-Haan, etc.).

AE wants to be perceived as affordable quality, not exclusive.  Nowhere in their business model, sales tactics, slogans, etc., do you see any hint of an attempt to be perceived as a luxury frills brand.  They value their grass-roots American heritage of supplying men with quality that lasts.

I think MWS has hit the nail on its head, here is an interview Paul did this year.

at 5:10 upon commenting on Christian Louboutin's men's shoe market, Paul said "they probably are not our kind of man. actually, we are very focused on urban, suburban professional men."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8j5j_vpw8wQ
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Classic Menswear
This thread is locked  
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Classic Menswear › Allen Edmonds Appreciation Thread - reviews, pictures, sizing, etc...