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Allen Edmonds Appreciation Thread - reviews, pictures, sizing, etc... - Page 1270  

post #19036 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post

 

Their site says 'Custom American Shoes' in the title, 'The Great American Shoe Company' all over the place, their blog talks a lot about their USA plant and their American heritage etc.,  yet they completely hide any and all information their Dominican Republic manufacturing? Really?? They are clearly trying to fool people. 

 

I don't know, when I purchased my Yuma's a month back I knew they were made in the DR and that was because I read this description on the website:

 

Made in the Dominican Republic with the same premium materials and workmanship as our Port Washington, Wisconsin factory

 

So 'any and all' seems a bit absolutist to me.  I think there are shades of grey to this.  I get that they don't want to advertise that they manufacture shoes in the DR.  It just sells better domestically to put the Port Washington plant first and foremost in consumers minds.  But are they being completely transparent about it?  No, that would be shitty marketing and *possibly* sell fewer shoes.

post #19037 of 70737
What in the hell happened to the Allen Edmonds website...
post #19038 of 70737
What do you mean?
post #19039 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoneyWellSpent View Post


I think kmdsimpson said everything extremely well here, and I agree with all of it.  The "Made of Fine Imported Leather" thing keeps frustrating me, because it keeps coming up.  The label of "Made of Fine Imported Leather" is in no way a nod to the manufactering of shoes in the Dominican Republic.  As kmdsimpson says, ALL of their shoes are now saying this on the insole.  Using imported leather is not new, it is not a degradation of quality, and it doesn't represent a change in their methods.  If you see an AE shoe without this label, it is probably old stock.  It doesn't necessarily mean that it is made of USA sourced leather.  I assure you, Alden shoes (since they are the other prominent American shoe maker) also purchases their hides (other than shell) from tanneries from other countries as well, just as all of the fine English shoemakers of Northampton do.  Making a product from the best available materials frequently requires importing goods.  Made in USA means alot to us from a quality and patriotic standpoint, but that doesn't mean that the USA produces the the highest quality natural materials all the time.  If your country produces the best of a particular type of natural resource or material, it is often luck rather than human effort due to climate, geography, landscape, etc. 

MoneyWellSpent, I completely agree on separating the issues of quality with place of manufacture/source. I assume we all want AE to manufacturer as much as they can in the US, as I assume they do, too. But then there are the practicalities of materials, cost notwithstanding.

It just further muddies the water with regard to labeling; what is "good" not made-in-the-USA vs. "bad"? Outsourcing labor is not good, because we have labor in the US. But outsourcing materials in some cases might be acceptable.

But then that gets in to quality discussions, too; there is a big assumption here that made in the USA is higher quality than made in the DR. That might or not might not be true... AE certainly says it is not.

To be clear, I have no problem with anyone saying that they prefer AE to manufacture in the US for social and economic reasons. The quality question, if it is asked, is much harder to determine.
post #19040 of 70737

My next shoe (outside of the current sale) was going to be burgundy cliftons.  I wish I had have gone w/ those townleys instead.

post #19041 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmdsimpson View Post

Got my Townleys yesterday. I was wearing a suit, so threw these on and took a quick picture. Other than being a blucher, they look great with a suit.

And boy, these are really shiny. They also smelled strongly of polish initially, overwhelming the "shell" smell. But leaving them out overnight has helped. I don't think I'll put any product on them to start.

Also seem a little duplicative of my brown Cliftons - but much nicer.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

I actually put mine on last night without socks on...just for a moment. The quality of these Townley's compared to my Neumok's is night and day. I know these are appox 2.5x more than the Neumoks of course. I have a feeling these won't be my last pair of shell cordovan shoes from AE.

post #19042 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by tampatravel View Post

I actually put mine on last night without socks on...just for a moment. The quality of these Townley's compared to my Neumok's is night and day. I know these are appox 2.5x more than the Neumoks of course. I have a feeling these won't be my last pair of shell cordovan shoes from AE.

COME ON USPS HURRY UP AND DELIVER MY TOWNLEYS
post #19043 of 70737

They look good. Are they the newer webgems with the MLB logos?

 

How long did it take for them to come in?
 

post #19044 of 70737

Anybody know what model this is? Are they actually shell cordovan? The left shoe looks like it may have creases as well as rolls.  Here's to hoping somebody doesn't snipe these from me!

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=121093807618

 

edit: I was already too late. Ouch.

post #19045 of 70737
AE nOOb question:

Other than B&S or eBay, would the McAllister first ever go below the current sale price of $249?
post #19046 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmdsimpson View Post


MoneyWellSpent, I completely agree on separating the issues of quality with place of manufacture/source. I assume we all want AE to manufacturer as much as they can in the US, as I assume they do, too. But then there are the practicalities of materials, cost notwithstanding.

It just further muddies the water with regard to labeling; what is "good" not made-in-the-USA vs. "bad"? Outsourcing labor is not good, because we have labor in the US. But outsourcing materials in some cases might be acceptable.

But then that gets in to quality discussions, too; there is a big assumption here that made in the USA is higher quality than made in the DR. That might or not might not be true... AE certainly says it is not.

To be clear, I have no problem with anyone saying that they prefer AE to manufacture in the US for social and economic reasons. The quality question, if it is asked, is much harder to determine.

 

I think AE finds itself between the proverbial "rock and a hard place."  They offer the highest quality shoes at their price point, and level of accessability, for American buyers.  People are currently placing enormous emphasis on "made in USA" but they also don't want prices to go up.  This inevitably causes conflict.  There are other threads that get into the AE vs. Alden quality debate, so it doesn't have to be delved into here.  However, this really boils down to one of the biggest differences between AE and Alden.  Alden is unionized and keeps manufactering closely reigned in to their Middleborough plant.  They don't expand, and they don't manufacter anything outside of Middleborough.  To get this, you have to pay over $100.00 more for calf shoes made by Alden.  Rather than expanding to meet demand, Alden allows quality control to suffer in order to keep cranking out shoes.  However, the price difference between AE and Alden is not reflective of a substantial difference in quality, if there is any truely objective difference between them quality wise.  Generally the debate threads end up with subjective differences in quality between the brands, and those who are more loyal to Alden consider them to be worth the extra money.  If AE is to satisfy the demands for their quality while keeping their prices low, they are forced to make some minor adjustments to their manufactering methods.  I think they have been successful in finding ways to do this while keeping the majority happy.  Obviously not everyone will be ok with their approach, as we have seen here. 

post #19047 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by bellyhungry View Post

AE nOOb question:

Other than B&S or eBay, would the McAllister first ever go below the current sale price of $249?

Probably not, unless you get gift cards as presents and wait until the American heritage sale (or whatever it's called) in the fall.

post #19048 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoneyWellSpent View Post

 

I think AE finds itself between the proverbial "rock and a hard place."  They offer the highest quality shoes at their price point, and level of accessability, for American buyers.  People are currently placing enormous emphasis on "made in USA" but they also don't want prices to go up.  This inevitably causes conflict.  There are other threads that get into the AE vs. Alden quality debate, so it doesn't have to be delved into here.  However, this really boils down to one of the biggest differences between AE and Alden.  Alden is unionized and keeps manufactering closely reigned in to their Middleborough plant.  They don't expand, and they don't manufacter anything outside of Middleborough.  To get this, you have to pay over $100.00 more for calf shoes made by Alden.  Rather than expanding to meet demand, Alden allows quality control to suffer in order to keep cranking out shoes.  However, the price difference between AE and Alden is not reflective of a substantial difference in quality, if there is any truely objective difference between them quality wise.  Generally the debate threads end up with subjective differences in quality between the brands, and those who are more loyal to Alden consider them to be worth the extra money.  If AE is to satisfy the demands for their quality while keeping their prices low, they are forced to make some minor adjustments to their manufactering methods.  I think they have been successful in finding ways to do this while keeping the majority happy.  Obviously not everyone will be ok with their approach, as we have seen here. 

 

Sorta funny, you say;

 

 "There are other threads that get into the AE vs. Alden quality debate, so it doesn't have to be delved into here." 

 

and then you delve right into it!

 

" People are currently placing enormous emphasis on "made in USA"

 

It's AE themselves doing that.

post #19049 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsmejson View Post


thx, so since they do not have 9.5E in stock my best bet would be the 10D?


@simpson - love those townleys.
 - i recently picked up the last 9.5D brown cliftons and have been breaking them in.  Ideally I would have wanted and E width but they were not available.  The only flaw I've found was on the stitching on the left cap toe that won't be an issue in the future.







clifton is such a great shoe. you could have a rock solid business/business casual shoe wardrobe with nothing more than cliftons in different colors. even the normal rules against wearing bluchers with suits seems like it doesn't apply to cliftons.
post #19050 of 70737
Quote:
Originally Posted by mediahound View Post

 

Sorta funny, you say;

 

 "There are other threads that get into the AE vs. Alden quality debate, so it doesn't have to be delved into here." 

 

and then you delve right into it!

 

" People are currently placing enormous emphasis on "made in USA"

 

It's AE themselves doing that.

 

That's incorrect on both counts.  I hardly delved into the debate.  I kept it to a limited point on the price difference as it relates to our current discussion on why they are using a factory in the DR and the post I was adding to from kmdsimpson.  The threads on the AE vs. Alden quality difference debates go into everything from leather quality, finishing quality, stitching quality, shoe fit, last shape, durability, comfort... need I go on? 

 

AE is placing great emphasis on their "made in USA" heritage because it is being demanded by the masses.  The fact that this entire conversation has been going on for so long is itself evidence for this because people are picking apart what it really  means to be "made in USA."  If no one cared, they wouldn't be picking apart the concept.  AE isn't the only company pushing the "made in USA" status of their products.  All of the major quality American brands are doing this.  Rancourt, Quoddy, Alden, Oakstreet...  A video on Vimeo with George Vlagos (founder of Oakstreet) touches on the heavy emphasis of this right now. 

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