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US waiters' worst conduct - Page 8

post #106 of 538
Probably becasue of the overbearing air of constraint one is forced to breathe when trying to discuss anything in a world where most everyone is a victim. Therefore criticisim of anyone in any real sense is lept upon by hordes of zealous lemmings as a slur, rather than being taken for what it might actually be. Political correctness has denied a great deal of meaning under the guise of the good it set out to do; it is now merely another way for people to escape responsibility, and limit the dialectic to a narrow form of orthodoxy. The poor public official who had the misfortune of a good vocabulary and used the word "niggardly" in quite the appropriate context can explain better, I'm sure. Regards, Huntsman
post #107 of 538
My father says the waiters at Jean Georges are "oppressive" and wishes they would leave you alone and stop giving you a detailed description of the dishes they are bringing and then telling you precisely how the chef suggests you consume it. I told him I kinda like it.
post #108 of 538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Margaret
While we're at it y'alls guys, why is it these days that anyone who takes offense at a racial, ethnic, religious, or political slur is sneeringly dismissed as being part of the insufferable, overbearing "PC Police"? Is bigotry now supposed to be a mark of intellectual sophistication?
I agree with Huntsman, but will add the observation that PC is basically self-serving rhetoric stealthily packaged in the guise of social justice. I think it's due in part to the overwhelming limits on discourse that PC artificially imposes (in other words, that it's all but impossible for someone to fulfill the constraints imposed by PC perfectly), but it's extremely rare that you find someone who practices a consistent brand of those principles. More often than not, loaded words like "bigot," "racist," and "homophobe" are just tossed out as buzzwords to avoid deep thought, because they attract attention very easily. That's not to say that such terms don't have weight (though I believe it's been greatly reduced by knee-jerk overuse), but it's hard to give PC any credibility the majority of time, when the people who espouse it are only doing so for their own cause. A good, fairly neutral example that shows the abuse of PC on both sides of the spectrum is the general push for "diversity" on college campuses. Whether you hear campus leftists or college Republicans complaining about a need to reorient the educational system in a push for diversity of ideas, you can rest assured that they only care about the bias of the other side and about the importance of exposing the world to their "diverse" agenda. Ok, that's off-topic enough for me; if someone wants to start this thread there's the politics forum.
post #109 of 538
Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethpollock
One problem is it is not always easy to tell when it is the management and when it is the purely the waiter. Sometimes it is the latter. I know this because twice in the last year I have gone to restaurants that I was very familar with and where no one there engaged in the practices that I abhor. However, on these two occasions, I got a new waiter who gave us the "full hick" treatment. It was obvious that these two guys brought with them their training from Red Lobster or Steak & Ale, etc., as the place that they were now working at did not require that behavior.
When I go to a place like the Buckhead Life Group, where I know that I am going to get the "treatment," I either fax them the BOR or call ahead to tell them that I find first name introductions, etc., abominable, and ask if it is absolutely required. Unless I get a real air-head, they usually accomodate me. Pretty much all of the old-pro managers know what they are having their waiters do is dead wrong and are actually embarrassed about it.
Maybe if more people complained, the word would filter up to top management and I could stop having to do this.

Like I said, a management issue. Management had the resume that said "Red Lobster" and sent them out to the Michelin 3-star anyway, without proper training and/or without proper oversight.

But, yes, to concede one point, it would sometimes be the waiter's sole fault.
post #110 of 538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jen
Right...You seem to think that it is fine to call southerners by nasty names. As if all who speak in a southern dialect are poor and uneducated? In fact, the quality of public education in Texas (I lived there for 5 years) far exceeds the quality of public education in California (I lived there for 7 years).
I believe Texas is one of the bottom 5 states in the country in that aspect, also in a number of other social services. I didn't realize California had it so bad. It may interest you to know that the Texas dialect is not just "y'all" and "howdy" but "fixin' to" is almost as common. It is used in place of "going to". As a matter of personal preference I try to speak only "standard" American English.
post #111 of 538
Quote:
The poor public official who had the misfortune of a good vocabulary and used the word "niggardly" in quite the appropriate context can explain better, I'm sure.

Charlton Heston had this happen to him IMMSMC. Poor, senile old bastard.
post #112 of 538
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zjpj83
My father says the waiters at Jean Georges are "oppressive" and wishes they would leave you alone and stop giving you a detailed description of the dishes they are bringing and then telling you precisely how the chef suggests you consume it. I told him I kinda like it.

Anybody noticed a pattern here: American restaurants put too much water in the espresso, ruining it; too many ingredients in the pasta sauce; too much stuff in the risotto (all from another thread about European dishes done worst here); the waiters talk too much and act like too pushy salesmen.
It is all "too much." I submit that this is the land of hype and overkill, where "awesome," "fantastic" and similiar words are always over-used. It is a nation absorbed with push, push, push, sell, sell, sell. Not too pleasant for those of us on the receiving end of this behavior, those who just want a nice, quiet night out and to be left largely alone.
post #113 of 538
Quote:
Originally Posted by kennethpollock
Anybody noticed a pattern here: ...

I notice a pattern in that you and Fabienne complain a lot. Maybe you should go out to dinner together so you can enjoy your sour grapes with like minded company.
post #114 of 538
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnVintage79
I notice a pattern in that you and Fabienne complain a lot. Maybe you should go out to dinner together so you can enjoy your sour grapes with like minded company.

Good idea! When can we get together?
post #115 of 538
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kent Wang
It may interest you to know that the Texas dialect is not just "y'all" and "howdy" but "fixin' to" is almost as common. It is used in place of "going to".

"Fixin' to" means something more liking "getting ready to", as in "I'm fixin' to go to town," or "I'm fixin' to shoot you," or "I'm fixin' to call my Vass source in Germany." [Edit: I misread Kent; he and I are saying the same thing.]

Quote:
As a matter of personal preference I try to speak only "standard" American English.

That way everyone can sound like he's from Ohio, and all regional interest and variety can be stamped out for good.
post #116 of 538
Re: American waiters:

Aren't the vast majority of American waiters non-professional: as in, they are waiting to tables to serve some other end, such as acting, writing, college, or a variety of other uncertain careers.

Whereas, in many European countries, and in many Latin American as well, the waiter is a professional, who has trained at waiting school, and has made a career out of it.

To someone from a background more oriented toward the professional school of waiting, American waiters might seem un-couth or familiar, while the obsequiousness(Sp?) of the European school often comes across as too feudal to many Americans
post #117 of 538
Thread Starter 
No one seems to dispute my claim that about 30-40 years ago virtually all US restaurants gave the type of proper service which I like. Now only a few of the very best do.
What are your thoughts about the reasons for the change.
Has the change been an improvement?
If not, why is that (other than the fact that I am old enough to remember the way things once were) I am one of the very few complaining?
Is there any rule or reason why lesser restaurants have to serve customers any differently from the best ones?
post #118 of 538
I believe in France there is an aspiration to become a waiter in certain types of restaurants while in America, the waiter profession is merely the stepping stone to an Oscar nomination.
post #119 of 538
Mr. Pollock,

While I agree that the plebish mannerisms of most waiters are slightly offputting, your pretensious, and abysmally affected dinining manifesto is equally as abominable as the manners which they speak out against. The first sign of breeding and sophistocation is the ability to turn a blind eye to the bafooneries that you described above, and go about your business. It is the sophists, poseurs, and ninnys who point them out which can be nothing else other than some strange freudian defence mechanism. I know more than one owner of fine establishments who'd probably piss in your soup while you wait if you sent him that. It's insulting.
post #120 of 538
Quote:
Originally Posted by vincent
Mr. Pollock,

While I agree that the plebish mannerisms of most waiters are slightly offputting, your pretensious, and abysmally affected dinining manifesto is equally as abominable as the manners which they speak out against. The first sign of breeding and sophistocation is the ability to turn a blind eye to the bafooneries that you described above, and go about your business. It is the sophists, poseurs, and ninnys who point them out which can be nothing else other than some strange freudian defence mechanism. I know more than one owner of fine establishments who'd probably piss in your soup while you wait if you sent him that. It's insulting.
ouch
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