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The StyleForum Working Hierarchical Suit Quality List (SFWHSQL!) - Page 44

post #646 of 843
2/8/13 at 12:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SirGrotius View Post

Anyone have experience with Band of Outsiders suits?

Made by Martin Greenfield or the Italian factory. Martin Greenfield is nice, italian factory not so much. Pretty overpriced at retail imo but I own a few from sales
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post #647 of 843
2/14/13 at 5:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Archimedes View Post

Can anyone recognize this label (see attached photo)? Also, what do WO, WM, WS stand for? If I remeber correctly the fabric was a wool/mohair blend so I suppose WO is wool, WM is mohair and WS cashmere?
Thank you in advance Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

label.jpg 2812k .jpg file

Your guesses on fabric abbreviations are correct.

A full list of those abbreviations in English, Finnish, Dutch, Swedish and German can be found here.
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post #648 of 843
2/14/13 at 10:23pm
Just wondering which one is the right one? CA is Acetate in the above and it's Hemp in this eBay Guide?
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post #649 of 843
3/7/13 at 11:03pm

- oops, deleted -

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post #650 of 843
3/25/13 at 11:06pm

Can anyone tell me where Zanella by Caruso fits in the hierarchy? I've seen some of their sport coats for sale on SF, but I'm not familiar.

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post #651 of 843
4/8/13 at 3:00pm

Could someone explain to me how RLBL suits are ranked above E.Zegna suits? I have 2 RLBL and 2 E.Zegna and they're both great piece of work but the difference in retail price is about $1,000. Yes, price isn't everything but does this mean E.Zegna suit prices are inflated?!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanAlex01 View Post

I think it's time, to get this flowing again. Bold are ones I have added. I removed some from Fumma's post--like Thom Browne (shudder) and Lanvin. And, for ease of use, I've made it all alphabetical.

Excellent [*****] (IE: Suits made this well are far and few between; if money is no object, your closet would be full of these. This category should be kept to only a few items.)

- Brioni
- Cesare Attolini Napoli
- D'Avenza
- Isaia
- Kiton
- Luciano Barbera Collezioni Sartoriale
- Luigi Borrelli
- RLPL
- Sartoria Castangia
- Sartoria Partenopea
- St Andrew

Very Good[****] (IE: Few suits match the quality of the ones in this category.)

- Belvest
- Borrelli Luxury Vintage
- Brooks Brothers Golden Fleece
- Canali Milano
- Corneliani Linea Sartoria
- Pal Zileri Sartoriale (I think there is another line higher than Sartoriale: The custom made one--IIRC "Abito Privato"--has excellent quality)
- Ravazzolo
- Sartoria Attolini Napoli
- (Most of Raffaelle Caruso) Sartoria Parma / RL Black Label / RL Signature
- Zegna Couture

Good[***] (IE: Quality is superior to most suits.)

- Boglioli
- Brooks Brothers Black Fleece
- Canali
- Cantarelli Tailor
- Corneliani
- Ermenegildo Zegna
- Faconnable Tailleur
- Giorgio Armani (Black Label)
- Hickey Freeman Mainline
- K by Canali
- Paul Smith Mainline (fully canvassed)
- Samuelsohn

Satisfactory [**] (IE: The "average" brands. Quality is acceptable.)

- Brooks Brothers 1818 (half canvassed)
- Cantarelli
- Charles Tyrwhitt
- H. Freemann
- Hackett
- Hickey
- Hickey Freeman LTD (half canvassed)
- Marks and Spencer (any of their "Pure Wool" collection)
- Paul Smith London (half canvassed)
- Racing Green
- Suitsupply
- Z-Zegna

Mediocre[*] (Suits that are mediocre.)

- Etro
- Hugo Boss
- J. Press
- Joseph Abboud
- Marco Valentino (half canvassed)
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post #652 of 843
4/8/13 at 3:53pm
The above list doesn't make any sense.

How is golden fleece (by Lardini and Southwick) in the same league as Zegna Couture?

Not all Caruso-made suits are made to the same standard. Some are hand made (RLPL) and some are machine made (RLBL).

And how is Etro mediocre when it's made by Boglioli, is half canvassed and has 100% silk lining?

Also, Armani black label might not be fully cavassed.
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post #653 of 843
4/12/13 at 5:25am

I don't see Oxxford listed anymore on your rankings.  Why?

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post #654 of 843
4/12/13 at 5:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudals1281 View Post

Could someone explain to me how RLBL suits are ranked above E.Zegna suits? I have 2 RLBL and 2 E.Zegna and they're both great piece of work but the difference in retail price is about $1,000. Yes, price isn't everything but does this mean E.Zegna suit prices are inflated?!

Overall E. Zegna (not Z Zegna) suit is a better quality garment than RLBL suit nevertheless IMHO Ralph Lauren got it right with the RLBL suiting line, as it offers good value for money (fully canvassed with sufficient bells and whistles) with aggressive cut. General public won't notice the details that make EZ a better suit unlike general SF community.
Quote:
Originally Posted by othertravel View Post

The above list doesn't make any sense.

How is golden fleece (by Lardini and Southwick) in the same league as Zegna Couture?

Not all Caruso-made suits are made to the same standard. Some are hand made (RLPL) and some are machine made (RLBL).

And how is Etro mediocre when it's made by Boglioli, is half canvassed and has 100% silk lining?

Also, Armani black label might not be fully cavassed.

The list was first collated few years back if you look on the first page thus few things had changed since then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tspidey0012 View Post

I don't see Oxxford listed anymore on your rankings.  Why?

The last time I inspected Oxxford garments was 1.5 years ago and in my view they're still one of the best, not sure with now though.
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post #655 of 843
4/12/13 at 6:30am
Oxxford belongs in the highest bracket. Their 'Highest Quality' line can compete with just about any OTR maker. Their 1220 line might be a notch down from the HQ line, but still has tons of handwork and has a great cut.
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post #656 of 843
4/12/13 at 8:28am

I actually like my Oxxford 1220 better than my St. Andrews RLPL suit. As far as handwork, they look much alike. Same goes for Construction and feel...slightly different fabric, but that's it. 1220 is probably the best "American made Italian suit" I've encountered.

 

I've also tried more standard Oxxford suits, and while being much more conservative, they're excellent. So yeah, Oxxford belongs in the highest bracket. 

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post #657 of 843
4/12/13 at 1:42pm

One thing to consider here is no matter how nice a suit is, if it doesn't fit me well, I ain't gonna buy it. Maybe I am saying something that is a no brainer but I would never buy a RLPL because I cannot properly fit into it regardless of its quality. I was at NeedlessMarkup couple weeks ago and tried on Tom Ford and Isaia and they were really nice but I looked like a kid wearing his dad's suit. I am 165lbs 6ft. I got off track but the point is I like the list but maybe there should be a list that would be reflective of age groups and their "taste."

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post #658 of 843
4/13/13 at 8:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamspace View Post

I actually like my Oxxford 1220 better than my St. Andrews RLPL suit. As far as handwork, they look much alike. Same goes for Construction and feel...slightly different fabric, but that's it. 1220 is probably the best "American made Italian suit" I've encountered.

I've also tried more standard Oxxford suits, and while being much more conservative, they're excellent. So yeah, Oxxford belongs in the highest bracket. 

The only problem is the 1220 pants are machine made, whereas the HQ line has the one-piece waistband set by hand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rudals1281 View Post

One thing to consider here is no matter how nice a suit is, if it doesn't fit me well, I ain't gonna buy it. Maybe I am saying something that is a no brainer but I would never buy a RLPL because I cannot properly fit into it regardless of its quality. I was at NeedlessMarkup couple weeks ago and tried on Tom Ford and Isaia and they were really nice but I looked like a kid wearing his dad's suit. I am 165lbs 6ft. I got off track but the point is I like the list but maybe there should be a list that would be reflective of age groups and their "taste."

If you're considering dropping loot on TF, then maybe bespoke should be an option
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post #659 of 843
4/16/13 at 5:35am
I have some Hart, Schaffner, and Marx (HSM) suits and sport coats. Where do you rank in terms of quality? I have always wonder if they are half or full canvas constructed. In addition, my local merchant has brought in Jack Victor. Opinions? Ranking?
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post #660 of 843
4/16/13 at 6:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanAlex01 View Post

I think it's time, to get this flowing again. Bold are ones I have added. I removed some from Fumma's post--like Thom Browne (shudder) and Lanvin. And, for ease of use, I've made it all alphabetical.

Excellent [*****] (IE: Suits made this well are far and few between; if money is no object, your closet would be full of these. This category should be kept to only a few items.)

- Brioni
- Cesare Attolini Napoli
- D'Avenza
- Isaia
- Kiton
- Luciano Barbera Collezioni Sartoriale
- Luigi Borrelli
- RLPL
- Sartoria Castangia
- Sartoria Partenopea
- St Andrew

Very Good[****] (IE: Few suits match the quality of the ones in this category.)

- Belvest
- Borrelli Luxury Vintage
- Brooks Brothers Golden Fleece
- Canali Milano
- Corneliani Linea Sartoria
- Pal Zileri Sartoriale (I think there is another line higher than Sartoriale: The custom made one--IIRC "Abito Privato"--has excellent quality)
- Ravazzolo
- Sartoria Attolini Napoli
- (Most of Raffaelle Caruso) Sartoria Parma / RL Black Label / RL Signature
- Zegna Couture

Good[***] (IE: Quality is superior to most suits.)

- Boglioli
- Brooks Brothers Black Fleece
- Canali
- Cantarelli Tailor
- Corneliani
- Ermenegildo Zegna
- Faconnable Tailleur
- Giorgio Armani (Black Label)
- Hickey Freeman Mainline
- K by Canali
- Paul Smith Mainline (fully canvassed)
- Samuelsohn

Satisfactory [**] (IE: The "average" brands. Quality is acceptable.)

- Brooks Brothers 1818 (half canvassed)
- Cantarelli
- Charles Tyrwhitt
- H. Freemann
- Hackett
- Hickey
- Hickey Freeman LTD (half canvassed)
- Marks and Spencer (any of their "Pure Wool" collection)
- Paul Smith London (half canvassed)
- Racing Green
- Suitsupply
- Z-Zegna

Mediocre[*] (Suits that are mediocre.)

- Etro
- Hugo Boss
- J. Press
- Joseph Abboud
- Marco Valentino (half canvassed)

Great,well organized list. I will refer to this list and any future updates when doing my suit or sportscoat/blazer shopping

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