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Canada Goose - Page 51

post #751 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluetree110 View Post

Canada Goose are actually terrible jackets. They are heavy, not waterproof, and not very versatile as far as temperature go. A proshell (all come with lifetime warrenties now), and a downfill midlayer is the only thing you'd actually want use as winter gear. That being said no one actually buys CG jackets as outdoor gear so I guess it's just a fashion thing, but I find that silly since they are actually quite ugly in my opinion.
Most of them are actually very low fill power coats, and despite being quite heavy they are very cold.

Oh boy. Here we go....

I would rather wear one coat versus a proshell + down jacket any day of the week.

The only Canada Goose coats that I would deem as 'heavy' are the Expedition and all other equally heavy relaxed fit CG coats. Those are meant to be warm in extreme cold conditions. While my Ontario is very warm and my Chateau is great for the Boston winter, I would not label those coats as 'heavy' in the sense you are describing them as, which is to say uncomfortable.

While I would certainly welcome CG to make their coats waterproof, I don't really see this as a huge deal. I would never wear any of my CG coats in temps that could possibly bring about rain. I also am not one to spend extended hours of time outside in the winter as it snowed heavily upon my coat.

No one buys CG as outdoor gear? If you mean for something like skiing, then yes, there are superior alternatives. But my Ontario would be perfectly suited for a very cold winter (IMO very cold) like Montreal or Toronto.

Ugly? Well that's a matter of taste but I'd argue that the Chateau is an especially nice looking coat.

Low fill power? 625 is plenty warm for 98% of consumers.

If you don't like CG that's cool but you are either trolling or just sharing some ridiculous statements.
post #752 of 1102
I got to try on a medium Chateau and thought it was too bulky for my tastes. I also got to try on a medium and a small Citadel and I loved fit of the small. I'm now on a quest to find a small spirit blue/navy one on sale. smile.gif
post #753 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by blairh View Post

Oh boy. Here we go....
I would rather wear one coat versus a proshell + down jacket any day of the week.
The only Canada Goose coats that I would deem as 'heavy' are the Expedition and all other equally heavy relaxed fit CG coats. Those are meant to be warm in extreme cold conditions. While my Ontario is very warm and my Chateau is great for the Boston winter, I would not label those coats as 'heavy' in the sense you are describing them as, which is to say uncomfortable.
While I would certainly welcome CG to make their coats waterproof, I don't really see this as a huge deal. I would never wear any of my CG coats in temps that could possibly bring about rain. I also am not one to spend extended hours of time outside in the winter as it snowed heavily upon my coat.
No one buys CG as outdoor gear? If you mean for something like skiing, then yes, there are superior alternatives. But my Ontario would be perfectly suited for a very cold winter (IMO very cold) like Montreal or Toronto.
Ugly? Well that's a matter of taste but I'd argue that the Chateau is an especially nice looking coat.
Low fill power? 625 is plenty warm for 98% of consumers.
If you don't like CG that's cool but you are either trolling or just sharing some ridiculous statements.

That's exactly the point; they are only useful for people who don't spend extended hours of time outside in the winter. I.E. they are fashion pieces and not outdoor gear at all. As well I guess 625 fill power is enough for 98% of people who walk from their front door to their car, and then from their car to heated work environment, but that isn't nearly adequate for the majority of Canada. Prairies routinely run -20 to -30 degrees celcius and if you plan on spending any time outdoors you'll find that isn't particularly warm. I am not trolling it's just they really aren't practical coats for anything. Considering the price a heavy cashmere jacket would look far nicer, and be about as functional as far as true outdoor gear goes.

I'd take my Loro Piana storm system over CG for the weather a CG is suitable for any day of the week.

Edit - I guess since I am into winter outdoors I got a bit carried away. I am sure most people on here like they way they look, and that is why they buy them. To each his own.
post #754 of 1102
^^ i bought it because they are warm jackets. period. id argue they are useless for people who go from front door to car, then into office, a wool coat would suffice for that total of 2 minutes outside. these have become fashion pieces, but they are not built for fashion (referring to the original jackets like expedition and heli arctic) they are built for extreme temperatures. it is not fair to argue price between a goose and some alternatives because a large portion of the price is the canadian wages that are being paid. When you say not for people outside for long times, what is a "long time"? thats very vague. I trek around campus in kingston with mine, and walk along the lake and am very warm. as a student i rarely get into a car and am always walking, and i find it very warm when the windchill gets to -15-20, and i've yet to put more than a t-shirt on underneath it.

if you don't like it there is nothing wrong with that, but you statements are vague and misleading.

last thing waterproofing would be useless considering wearing these in the rain would be utterly stupid.
post #755 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluetree110 View Post

That's exactly the point; they are only useful for people who don't spend extended hours of time outside in the winter. I.E. they are fashion pieces and not outdoor gear at all. As well I guess 625 fill power is enough for 98% of people who walk from their front door to their car, and then from their car to heated work environment, but that isn't nearly adequate for the majority of Canada. Prairies routinely run -20 to -30 degrees celcius and if you plan on spending any time outdoors you'll find that isn't particularly warm. I am not trolling it's just they really aren't practical coats for anything. Considering the price a heavy cashmere jacket would look far nicer, and be about as functional as far as true outdoor gear goes.
I'd take my Loro Piana storm system over CG for the weather a CG is suitable for any day of the week.
Edit - I guess since I am into winter outdoors I got a bit carried away. I am sure most people on here like they way they look, and that is why they buy them. To each his own.

By extended hours of time I was referring to the fact that CG aren't waterproof, not that they aren't warm enough. You seem to be using the term 'outdoor gear' as in a garment that can be of use outside in cold temps for something beyond a short period (in your words, walk from car to work, etc). I certainly can't speak for residents of Toronto or Montreal, but here in Boston I definitely find my Chateau to be sufficient. The Ontario of course is too.

I don't know why you are bring up the prairies of Canada. Anybody with common sense would know that something like the Chateau is not going to cut it in such cold temps unless you layer quite a bit under your coat. I don't think CG would even claim that their slim fit coats are sufficient protection for the prairies. Something like the Chateau is really meant for major cities and suburbs that aren't as extremely cold as the temps you quote. For something like -20/-30 you'd be better off with the Ontario or Expedition.

They are practical coats. I don't get where this rage is stemming from or aimed at. There are people who have contributed in this thread who live in Montreal and Toronto and I don't see them complaining that their CG coats are not warm enough.
post #756 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by linds_15 View Post

last thing waterproofing would be useless considering wearing these in the rain would be utterly stupid.

Useless, no. There can be moments when you have snow or sleet on your coat and you go indoors for a brief period of time (say shopping). If you forget to brush the snow off your coat then there is the potential that it can melt onto your coat. A waterproof coat basically eliminates any worry that any snow or the like has the potential to seep into your coat in a given circumstance. Also I think waterproof coats retain heat a bit more. I certainly would welcome CG making their parkas waterproof in the future, but I doubt they will.
post #757 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by linds_15 View Post

^^ i bought it because they are warm jackets. period. id argue they are useless for people who go from front door to car, then into office, a wool coat would suffice for that total of 2 minutes outside. these have become fashion pieces, but they are not built for fashion (referring to the original jackets like expedition and heli arctic) they are built for extreme temperatures. it is not fair to argue price between a goose and some alternatives because a large portion of the price is the canadian wages that are being paid. When you say not for people outside for long times, what is a "long time"? thats very vague. I trek around campus in kingston with mine, and walk along the lake and am very warm. as a student i rarely get into a car and am always walking, and i find it very warm when the windchill gets to -15-20, and i've yet to put more than a t-shirt on underneath it.
if you don't like it there is nothing wrong with that, but you statements are vague and misleading.
last thing waterproofing would be useless considering wearing these in the rain would be utterly stupid.

Yes, I am sure it is great for walking around campus... Clearly you have no idea what you are talking about if you think a waterproof coat is "utterly stupid". If you are going into the back country for more than a day hike without water proofing you are asking for trouble. Once down gets wet it is not warm. And if I have to inform you that your down will get wet without goretex you clearly don't do anything other than walk around campus.

Blairh you are right, I suppose it is a practical coat for city living. The reason I bring it up is because I think alot of people buy the coats really thinking they are getting the best their is, and have a coat that is actually fit for doing winter expeditions. I feel like people get duped by the company. People seem to think since they spent so much money on the coat they really are getting the best their is when a proshell and down midlayer is a far superior alternative in many circumstances.

By the way the expedition, and ontario coats both only have 625 fill power. That would not be suitable for prairies or much of Ontario (not Toronto which is the warmest part..) for any length of time without very heavy baselayer (if I must be more specific if I weren't moving around alot I'd be cold after no more than 30 minutes).

EDIT- BTW linds I can argue about the price because arcteryx proshells are made in Canada as well.
post #758 of 1102
Anyone know why arcteryx doesn't make down jackets ?
post #759 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluetree110 View Post


Yes, I am sure it is great for walking around campus... Clearly you have no idea what you are talking about if you think a waterproof coat is "utterly stupid". If you are going into the back country for more than a day hike without water proofing you are asking for trouble. Once down gets wet it is not warm. And if I have to inform you that your down will get wet without goretex you clearly don't do anything other than walk around campus.
Blairh you are right, I suppose it is a practical coat for city living. The reason I bring it up is because I think alot of people buy the coats really thinking they are getting the best their is, and have a coat that is actually fit for doing winter expeditions. I feel like people get duped by the company. People seem to think since they spent so much money on the coat they really are getting the best their is when a proshell and down midlayer is a far superior alternative in many circumstances.
By the way the expedition, and ontario coats both only have 625 fill power. That would not be suitable for prairies or much of Ontario (not Toronto which is the warmest part..) for any length of time without very heavy baselayer (if I must be more specific if I weren't moving around alot I'd be cold after no more than 30 minutes).
EDIT- BTW linds I can argue about the price because arcteryx proshells are made in Canada as well.

 

@Bluetree,

 

Your posts are very full of misinformation.

 

First of all, Fill Power by itself is only part of the warmth equation.  Fill Power is ONLY a measure of the fluffiness of the down.  It's true that higher fill powers are warmer ounce for ounce, but 2 ounces of 625 would be far warmer than 1 ounce of 800.  Judging the warmth of a coat by the fill power is simply not doable.  You have to consider fill Power and amount of down as well as construction.

 

Second, you would not take the relaxed fit versions of these coats for an extended outdoor activity on anything less than a true artic or antartic expedition.  And that's not because they aren't warm enough, it's because they are too warm.  Anything less than those extreme conditions, you would not have to worry about waterproofing because your sweat would be enough to cause wetness issues.  Even then, they are too warm for most active conditions.  And if you ARE wearing them on those types of expeditions, you are still layering.  Some of what you are saying about not taking CG on most outdoor activities is true for many conditions but that does not mean its true for all conditions.

 

Here's a good webpage and video down below from a researcher who lives in the Antarctic.  He talks about how you use layering to achieve proper regulation of body temp.  If you are standing around in camp, that's when you go for the down filled parkas.  Why?  Because those are the warmest.

 

http://www.coolantarctica.com/Antarctica%20fact%20file/science/clothing_in_antarctica.htm

 

There are many manufacturers making many different products which are designed to be ideal for different sets of circumstances.  Calling Canada Goose products inferior to others is like calling the Space Shuttle a poor airplane.

 


 

 

post #760 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluetree110 View Post


Blairh you are right, I suppose it is a practical coat for city living. The reason I bring it up is because I think alot of people buy the coats really thinking they are getting the best their is, and have a coat that is actually fit for doing winter expeditions. I feel like people get duped by the company. People seem to think since they spent so much money on the coat they really are getting the best their is when a proshell and down midlayer is a far superior alternative in many circumstances.
By the way the expedition, and ontario coats both only have 625 fill power. That would not be suitable for prairies or much of Ontario (not Toronto which is the warmest part..) for any length of time without very heavy baselayer (if I must be more specific if I weren't moving around alot I'd be cold after no more than 30 minutes).
EDIT- BTW linds I can argue about the price because arcteryx proshells are made in Canada as well.

The Expedition was created for (and is used) by scientists working at the McMurdo station in Antarctica. So to claim that it isn't suitable for the prairies is ridiculous.

The Expedition and similar relaxed cut CG coats are designed with the intention of layers being worn under the coat.

With proper layering underneath, you'll be plenty warm in an Expedition for 30 mins and more standing in place in the temps you quoted.

You are too caught up in fill power and thinking that something that features 625 fill power down isn't warm. It is. I have an 800 fill Patagonia jacket and it's on par warmth-wise with my Chateau. The power of the down, the amount of actual down, the materials of the outer shell, and the construction of the coat, all play a factor in how warm a down coat really is.

Edit - SDiver68 posted his reply while I was providing mine. Funny how we said most of the same things.
post #761 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by tedbearz View Post

Anyone know why arcteryx doesn't make down jackets ?


They do!

post #762 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by blairh View Post


Their business seems legit I just don't know if that site is safe to order off or not. I guess if anyone wants that coat you should maybe call them directly.
There were some Woolrich parkas at my local Bloomingdale's and Neiman's before Xmas. I'm assuming they were John Rich & Bros. They were okay in person. The fur wasn't very soft and I wasn't really impressed overall. I wouldn't pay more than $300 for one at retail.


Interesting, I thought them to be at least as nice as the CG.  Only the Made in Canada JR&Bros versions, the made in China versions are not nice and I have not seen the Made in USA versions in person.  I went to Neimann to see the CG but kept coming back to the Woolrich.  Anyway, differing opinions and I'm positive you are a much better judge of style then I although I was an Executive for a mid-level Department store for 6 years so I have a little experience.

post #763 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdiver68 View Post



Interesting, I thought them to be at least as nice as the CG.  Only the Made in Canada JR&Bros versions, the made in China versions are not nice and I have not seen the Made in USA versions in person.  I went to Neimann to see the CG but kept coming back to the Woolrich.  Anyway, differing opinions and I'm positive you are a much better judge of style then I although I was an Executive for a mid-level Department store for 6 years so I have a little experience.

I don't know for sure what branch of Woolrich the coats I saw in Bloomingdale's and Neiman's were from but my guess is JR & Bros. Especially considering they were selling for $695 at Bloomingdale's. I'm making my value judgment based on what I observed from the rack. I never bothered to try one on. I did inspect the fur and found it to be less soft then anything I've touched on a CG coat. Looks wise I just wasn't impressed. I also noticed that both retail stores had tons of the Woolrich coats in stock.

Judging style is a subjective matter. I certainly can't claim to be better at it then you. However if I'm interested in an item in a retail store I do make a point to inspect it and then make up my mind about how much something is "worth". I then make a guess as to what the item is selling for at retail. As I stated, the Woolrich parkas I saw weren't worth more than $300 at retail IMHO. Keep in mind that's just my take on it. At the same time I honestly don't think a CG parka (something that hits mid-thigh and sports fur) is worth more than $400. Canada Goose sold their coats at significantly lower prices back in 2009,(Chateau was $495 then) so it's a better indication of the true value of the coat.
post #764 of 1102
the argument is getting stupid because so many different variables are being thrown in to prove a point. A goose simply isn't perfect for any situation. I was wrong when I said it would be useless to waterproof, that was more my opinion, because the only time it would be routinely useful is when you go from snowy to a heated place like blairh quoted and didnt pat yourself down of all the snow before entering so it doesnt melt. This is very true, I didn't consider this because I'm personally in the habit of wiping off all the snow as I enter a building. Also, I didn't say a waterproof coat is useless, I have several for the fact they are waterproof, I said I think waterproofing Gooses for the most part would be futile. If you are bringing a goose on a day+ hike in the back country for more than a day you would be pretty wrong to bring a goose as your coat. And if you believe it has to be Gore-Tex to be any good, you're even more wrong
post #765 of 1102
Quote:
Originally Posted by blairh View Post


By extended hours of time I was referring to the fact that CG aren't waterproof, not that they aren't warm enough. You seem to be using the term 'outdoor gear' as in a garment that can be of use outside in cold temps for something beyond a short period (in your words, walk from car to work, etc). I certainly can't speak for residents of Toronto or Montreal, but here in Boston I definitely find my Chateau to be sufficient. The Ontario of course is too.
I don't know why you are bring up the prairies of Canada. Anybody with common sense would know that something like the Chateau is not going to cut it in such cold temps unless you layer quite a bit under your coat. I don't think CG would even claim that their slim fit coats are sufficient protection for the prairies. Something like the Chateau is really meant for major cities and suburbs that aren't as extremely cold as the temps you quote. For something like -20/-30 you'd be better off with the Ontario or Expedition.
They are practical coats. I don't get where this rage is stemming from or aimed at. There are people who have contributed in this thread who live in Montreal and Toronto and I don't see them complaining that their CG coats are not warm enough.

 

It usually warm enough for me but I put on a Duluth Trading Shoreman's Fleece Jacket underneath my Canada Goose to cope with low nighttime temperatures. It blocks the chill. CG is an excellent coat by itself most of the time but in extreme cold weather, layering it will help to create additional warmth.
 

 

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