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Slam Magazine's 50 Best NBA Players - Page 6

post #76 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLMountainMan View Post
Wilt was, by far, the most dominant player ever. If he played now, he wouldn't be as dominant, but he would still be the best player in the league. He would be better than Shaq was in his prime.

He was Shaq's size, but much, much more athletic (was on his college track team). Like Shaq, there were few players as big as him - Gilmore, Russell, Reed were all big, but not as big.

His conditioning was amazing, especially considering that this was in the era before personal trainers, team dieticians, etc. His second year in the league he averaged over 48 minutes per game, (and averaged over 50 pts, 25 rebounds per game).

He's the only center to ever lead the league in assists.

He transformed the game of basketball.

I might have to disagree with that a bit. He did change the game and probably the pioneer of the game today but back then, he just outmatched everyone. I do not see him dropping a 100 point game today, especially with the Zone Defense. He has more ability than Shaq but I think Shaq (in his prime) would punish Wilt in the paint. It would be a great match up to see but NBA players today are more athletic than being fundamentally sound and that plays a role, especially in the defensive end. I can' see him playing 48 minutes of offense and defense against Shaq or Dwight. No doubt he was a great player, but in his prime, I do not think he would dominate or even be the best player in the league today with Lebron, Kobe, CP3, Garnett, Howard, etc...
post #77 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by matadorpoeta View Post
if michael jordan had spent his career with the clippers, he'd have zero titles, but he would have been the same player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroStyles View Post
Michael Jordan was the kind of player that would have won a title even on a shitty team. He just was.
Exactly. The Bulls weren't some dominant team before Jordan came to them. My friends & I would stand outside Chicago Stadium as kids and try to score tickets to go in. Usually, we'd get a ticket free. They were giving them away, literally. We could end up sitting 10 rows from the court just to show you how empty the Stadium was unless the Lakers, Celtics, or Sixers came to town. Sure, we had fun cheering on Orlando Woolridge, Dave Corzine, and the boys but really at that time the Bulls WERE the L.A. Clippers...actually had a worse record that the Clippers. I mean you don't get the third pick in the draft because you're a playoff team. Then MJ came to town and everything changed. He made the players around him better, as he would have on the Clippers or any other team. As much as I loved Scottie Pippen, on another team, I don't think Pippen would have developed into the player he did. To this day in Chicago, we still thank Portland for picking Sam Bowie over MJ in the draft.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thekunk07 View Post
sorry, you misunderstood, i said sport.
LoL
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFX45 View Post
First of all, it is SLAM Magazine, enough said.
Truth.
post #78 of 124
Jordan, Magic, Bird Kareem are top 4.
post #79 of 124
great point about gretzky. my over site.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JD_May View Post
I think Gretzky is at least as far above the field... Bobby Orr is a consensus #2 for hockey, and I don't think many would make a case that he should be #1. Mario Lemieux, if not for illness, might have had a chance. But top 10 NHL career point totals look like this.

Gretzky - 2857
Messier - 1887
Howe - 1850
Francis - 1798
Dionne - 1771
Yzerman - 1755
Lemieux - 1723
Sakic - 1641
Jagr - 1599
Esposito - 1590

It's not even close.
post #80 of 124
Rick Barry at 21??!?!!?!
post #81 of 124
^was a real asshole but a great player.
post #82 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by rnoldh View Post
I've seen everyone of them play live except Dolph Schayes!

You saw Mikan play?
post #83 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLMountainMan View Post
Kwiteboy is hilarious. I would call him ignorant, but remember that his generation has had self-esteem drilled into their heads relentlessly. Results are unimportant, only potential. So, yeah. LBJ is the greatest from that perspective.

Wilt was, by far, the most dominant player ever. If he played now, he wouldn't be as dominant, but he would still be the best player in the league. He would be better than Shaq was in his prime.

He was Shaq's size, but much, much more athletic (was on his college track team). Like Shaq, there were few players as big as him - Gilmore, Russell, Reed were all big, but not as big.

His conditioning was amazing, especially considering that this was in the era before personal trainers, team dieticians, etc. His second year in the league he averaged over 48 minutes per game, (and averaged over 50 pts, 25 rebounds per game).

He's the only center to ever lead the league in assists.

He transformed the game of basketball.

I think people forget that the object of the game is to win, not to compile gaudy statistics. Wilt is an all time great for sure, but he still only managed to win two titles despite playing in a league in which he physically outmatched his opponents to a greater degree than perhaps any player in the history of the league. I'm not old enough to have seen him play, but I have to assume from his record that he was less of a player than Russell, Kareem or Shaq.
post #84 of 124
i've watched enough tape to know this wasn't the case. wilt became an epic passer late in his career.

his pussy numbers alone count for something.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron View Post
I think people forget that the object of the game is to win, not to compile gaudy statistics. Wilt is an all time great for sure, but he still only managed to win two titles despite playing in a league in which he physically outmatched his opponents to a greater degree than perhaps any player in the history of the league. I'm not old enough to have seen him play, but I have to assume from his record that he was less of a player than Russell, Kareem or Shaq.
post #85 of 124
Best in their sport by the largest margin.

1. Gretzky
2. Ali
3. Pele
post #86 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by StephenHero View Post
Best in their sport by the largest margin.
2. Ali There is no consensus that Ali was the best ever. None. Not the best fighter, not the best heavyweight, let alone "largest margin."
post #87 of 124
Who was better? Joe Louis or Tyson. Those are the only two I could honestly say were close.
post #88 of 124
+1. if i never hear another word about his greatness in all endeavors, it will be too soon.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron View Post
2. Ali


There is no consensus that Ali was the best ever. None. Not the best fighter, not the best heavyweight, let alone "largest margin."
post #89 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by StephenHero View Post
Who was better? Joe Louis or Tyson. Those are the only two I could honestly say were close.

Here's one pretty methodical breakdown. http://coxscorner.tripod.com/boxchart1.html If you read it you'll see that Ali is tied for first among heavyweights with Louis. My point isn't that Ali sucked, it's that there's no consensus that he's the best heavyweight ever by a large margin. He's in the conversation.
post #90 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by kwiteaboy View Post
Did I say potential? I said ability. Using PER, the most comprehensive metric of an individual player's team-independent value, LeBron's 2008-09 season was the best non-MJ individual season since the NBA started tracking individual turnovers in 1977. As the 2008-09 season is now over, I think we can start calling it a result, as results are things that have already happened, not things that have the potential to happen, but double-check that definition for me, as I'm ignorant.

Do you see how you prove my point here? He had one great season.
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