or Connect
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Classic Menswear › How to not step on the boss' toes?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

How to not step on the boss' toes? - Page 2

post #16 of 29
Quote:
The partner who I'm working for right now in NYC wore a Hickey Freeman suit today.  I'm wearing an Oxxford today.  During lunch we removed our jackets and it was clear that we each caught a glimpse of the jacket labels, and it was clear we both knew what we saw.  He said pleasantly, "You dress up very nicely" (the first time he met me I had a bad five o'clock shadow and was wearing jeans and a t-shirt).
Yes, your Oxxford supposedly cost more. But, his suit may be the MTM, highly hand tailored Hickey model, for which he personally chose the perfect fabric. And that he is very satisfied with and loves dearly. I may prefer his to your OTR Oxxford. I believe you may be giving yourself too many style points.
post #17 of 29
Quote:
Yes, your Oxxford supposedly cost more. But, his suit may be the MTM, highly hand tailored Hickey model, for which he personally chose the perfect fabric. And that he is very satisfied with and loves dearly. I may prefer his to your OTR Oxxford. I believe you may be giving yourself too many style points.
I don't think this was a contest.
post #18 of 29
Quote:
Quote:
(johnnynorman3 @ May 05 2005,15:36) The partner who I'm working for right now in NYC wore a Hickey Freeman suit today. I'm wearing an Oxxford today. During lunch we removed our jackets and it was clear that we each caught a glimpse of the jacket labels, and it was clear we both knew what we saw. He said pleasantly, "You dress up very nicely" (the first time he met me I had a bad five o'clock shadow and was wearing jeans and a t-shirt).
Yes, your Oxxford supposedly cost more. But, his suit may be the MTM, highly hand tailored Hickey model, for which he personally chose the perfect fabric. And that he is very satisfied with and loves dearly. I may prefer his to your OTR Oxxford. I believe you may be giving yourself too many style points.
Charely, I don' t think this was meant as a pissing contest. luc
post #19 of 29
I worked in a large law firm for almost 7 years.  My general experience is that no one really cares as long as you don't go around flaunting it.  No offense, but very few people are going to be able to tell that you're wearing an Oxxford just by looking at it (they may be able to tell you're wearing a nice suit, but, for most, I honestly think this has more to do with fit than quality).  Unless you broadcast how expensive your clothing is, no one will know or care.  On the other hand, if your firm is business casual and all of your peers as well as most of the more senior attorneys come to work dressed casually, wearing a suit every day will make you stand out.  I don't think this will necessarily hurt your career, but you'll get a few comments ("What are you, interviewing?", etc.).  Your peers might refer to you as a brown noser. Also, not to get off on a tangent, but
Quote:
I'm talking about summer associates, who are at the bottom of the totem pole.
Not true.  First year associate are at the bottom of the totem pole.  Summer associates are wined and dined.
Quote:
Kind of like you may be expected to work weekends.  Alone.  While the partners go out on their boats.  Or why they can go home at 4:00 and you'll be expected to stay 'til 6.
Hate to burst your bubble here, but I'll bet most associates of whatever level working at a large law firm in NYC can count on one hand the number of days over the past year that they were able to go home at 6.  Also, my experience has been that the partners (at least the junior and mid-level ones) work just as hard as (if not harder than) the associates.  This is one of the reasons I no longer work at a large law firm.
post #20 of 29
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charley,May 05 2005,21:29
Yes, your Oxxford supposedly cost more. But, his suit may be the MTM, highly hand tailored Hickey model, for which he personally chose the perfect fabric.  And that he is very satisfied with and loves dearly. I may prefer his to your OTR Oxxford.  I believe you may be giving yourself too many style points.
Charely, I don' t think this was meant as a pissing contest. luc
I don't know what sort of contest it is supposed to be - in my estimation there is not one either.  However, the question, as posed, presented it as if there was a contest.  "If my clothing is better than my boss' clothing, will there be a problem?"  So that the consideration is whether XXX is better than YYY, and does anyone know the difference or care about the degree of difference.
post #21 of 29
Agree with everything JBZ said.  Wearing a nice suit is different from driving a nice car (see previous thread started by Renault asking for car recommendations) -- most people aren't going to be able to tell the difference between Kiton and Men's Wearhouse.  If you wear a suit, people will think you are well-dressed, and you will endear yourself to some old-schoolers who hate business casual.  I would stay away from flashy cufflinks and pocket squares, however, unless that's standard attire for the office.   What you wear as a summer associate doesn't matter at all unless it's really sloppy.  Most summer associate programs are a complete joke.  You'll probably need to complete 2 or 3 assignments and do a decent job on them.  Most firms write off summer associate work anyways.
Quote:
Also, my experience has been that the partners (at least the junior and mid-level ones) work just as hard as (if not harder than) the associates.  This is one of the reasons I no longer work at a large law firm.
I have heard someone say that making partner at a large law firm "is like winning a pie-eating contest.  The prize is more pie."  That's why I'm no longer at a big firm either.
post #22 of 29
Quote:
Renault asking for car recommendations
post #23 of 29
Quote:
Agree with everything JBZ said.
You're the first.
Quote:
I have heard someone say that making partner at a large law firm "is like winning a pie-eating contest. The prize is more pie."
An apt description, and one I've heard before as well. More power to the people who are able to do the large firm thing for the long haul. The money can certainly be very good (although, I think, for the vast majority, it's not as good as the public perception). Personally, it's more important to me to see my wife and son on a regular basis.
post #24 of 29
Quote:
An apt description, and one I've heard before as well. More power to the people who are able to do the large firm thing for the long haul. The money can certainly be very good (although, I think, for the vast majority, it's not as good as the public perception). Personally, it's more important to me to see my wife and son on a regular basis.
Ditto.
post #25 of 29
[off topic] Couple of points: (1) re compensation. At most of the large firms, associates at least, are paid on a lock-step basis (or on some other mathmatical equation based on billed hours). There's not much room here for your dress habits to change compensation. (2) re large firm hours. Yes, they can be long, but they need not necessarily be as insane as some people are making them out to be. Maybe I just picked the right firm, but I haven't worked more than a couple weekends since I started last year, and while getting out at 6 is definitely early (5:30 is the end of the official business day at most firms), that doesn't necessarily mean you're staying until midnight every night. Most of the time I leave either at 7:30/8 (when getting dinner at home or out with my wife), or at 10 or 10:30 if I do have dinner at the firm. I know I'll get busier in the coming years, but so far at least, things are not insane. [/off topic] Back to the real topic. Your dress, at a large firm in the city, will not make or break your career as long as you are within normal bounds of reasonable business attire. The bottom line is that you should dress in a way that makes *you* feel comfortable/professional (within these limits). As others have hinted, there is a very large chance that you will not spend very much of your career at a large firm.
post #26 of 29
My 2 cents would be: as a summer associate, try to dress in a style similar to the well-dressed senior associates/junior partners, and don't overdo it with flash, at least during business hours. Most important things: whether people like working with you, and whether they feel you are enthusiastic and dedicated to the assignments they give you.
post #27 of 29
This is a really funny issue. If you wear nice clothes, very often people will think you're rich. I think this issue comes into play if you're overly flashy or underperforming. And I agree that most people don't know the difference between an Oxxford and a piece of junk. For instance, I've been getting a lot of compliments on this $200 piece of junk I've been wearing since I put on weight. At one of my previous jobs (I am a slob again since most of my nice clothes don't fit anymore) people thought I was very wealthy. I was just good at hunting the deals. I find it illogical to pay $80 for a Banana Republic sweater when I can get a Canali on sale for $50.
post #28 of 29
Law firm hours aren't "insane" when compared to say, the hours of an ER resident. The problem is that you are truly at the mercy of the client, as well as partners who could call at any minute. So, on days when I have literally no work -- or finish with my work by 4 or 5 pm -- I have to sit on my ass in my office "just in case" until 6:30. And then if someone calls me at 6:30 for some idiotic conference call that I don't need to be on, all of the sudden it's 8:30 when I get home. Sure, there are weeks when I leave the office at 5 pm every day, but those times are rare. I think that the idea that getting home at 8 pm -- time enough to have dinner with the wife -- is "normal" or "sufficient" is just crazy. As for dress, flashy and cheap will draw more attention than expensive and understated. For example, there is a guy in my office who wears very cheap suits, but they are in loud "clubby" fabrics, and he pairs them with "stripey" and loud ties. This will draw much more attention than anything of the $2500 suits I have in my closet. The brilliance of an expensive suit is that, unless you know what your are looking for, it doesn't look expensive. It just looks good.
post #29 of 29
Quote:
   The brilliance of an expensive suit is that, unless you know what your are looking for, it doesn't look expensive.  It just looks good.
Amen... and thank you. I once worked for a woman who actually advised other women not to dress well or do makeup because they should look smart, not pretty. She bitched at me one day for wearing a sportcoat and tie to give my presentation because 'you are supposed to be the technical expert, not a fashion model' My reply was something like... "Perhaps, but there is nothing inappropriate about a man wearing a coat and tie when presenting to the C-level guys on a large deal. It isn't like a 250 pound woman showing up in the boardroom in stretch pants and an untucked shirt without washing her hair for a week or something equally disrespectful". Oh well, I'm doing something I like now, she's still ugly and a nasty b.tch... getting out of there was a good thing :-) ...Probably not a smart thing to say but if dressing well intimidates someone else then perhaps the problem is that they need to dress better and not that you need to out-slob them. PS> Do as I dress, not as I say.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Classic Menswear
Styleforum › Forums › Men's Style › Classic Menswear › How to not step on the boss' toes?