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The Architecture Thread - Page 293

post #4381 of 4539
Nice, with one minor do you build a structure with exposed beams and not employ traditional method and solid beams rather than those fabricated jobs.... When you are building in the place where Japanese carpenters come from.
post #4382 of 4539
Wouldn't solid beams and traditional joinery be multiples more expensive?
post #4383 of 4539
Yep. The project probably had a budget that precludeed such extravagance.
post #4384 of 4539
Doesn't exactly look like a budget build and all of the finish carpentry (walnut partition, shelves, ect) is quite nice.

Not a complaint I would normally make, but if you're going to build a place like this, and the fabrication of the beams is not key to their function (curving, ect), I think it would be great to see solid beams. Solid beams and their applied finishes (smooth, finished with a yari-ganna, chona (Japanese adze) or ono (broad axe) would add a lot of sex appeal to that house and play nicely with the finish carpentry of the remainder of the interior.

If I understand correctly contemporary work in Japan is also dictated by a tear-down schedule, which probably plays into the decision making I'm sure.

So....just some brain droppings...
post #4385 of 4539
Laminated wood beams are your only option. They're significantly stronger. They also require significantly less drying time than solid timber beams so they aren't taking up space in a warehouse for 2-3 years before construction, which has gotta be prohibitively costly in Japan. You can make them out of new growth wood, which is orders of magnitude cheaper, assuming they're being imported from China (a safe assumption). They can also be reinforced with steel channels if necessary so you get tensile strength of steel with the fireproofing of timber. And a major plus for contractors is the their dimensional accuracy and structural reliability, so you can take the dimensionally-accurate beam and use a computerized router in a factory to cut out the channels for any reinforcing. It's much more difficult to do with solid wood because the wood has a higher rate of expansion and is rarely accurate enough. You're also forced to over-structure with solid wood because hidden deformities can lower its strength, so even if you could find beams strong enough you'd lose a bunch of ceiling height in the process. With laminated beams, you can eliminate any pieces of wood with knots or other strength-reducing irregularities, and then you can laminate them by alternating the direction of the grain to increase the strength. The spans in this shot just aren't gonna happen with any solid wood beam. Laminate wood beams are just a necessary reality if you want to build with timber. Personally, I really love them. They're so damn efficient, and they can have a really beautiful pattern of laminations. Unless I was using reclaimed timber beams for a small project, laminate beams would always be my preference.

Edited by StephenHero - 12/19/15 at 12:20pm
post #4386 of 4539
Don't worry, bro. I got solid timber for you!

Makoto Yamaguchi
Salon House Reconstruction
Narimasu, Japan
Originally Built in 1870; Reconstructed in 2014

post #4387 of 4539
Scenic Architecture
Victory Street Neighborhood Center
Zhujiajiao, China

post #4388 of 4539
Both of those are incredible. icon_gu_b_slayer[1].gif

Good points Stephen.

It's quite an undertaking to source suitable lumber for those sort of things. I've been attempting to source good quality old growth alaskan yellow cedar (actually a cypress) for a door. The real old growth stuff is like plastic the grain is so tight, but not easy to find. 40 Years ago they would just clear cut and use it for firewood....1000 yr old timber used for you have to go through specialized sources to get it, same deal with Port Orford Cedar.

Those two are what the Japanese love, since they cant take down their old growth cedars really.
post #4389 of 4539
Have you ever read this? It's fascinating. You'd really like it. It has all these great historical anecdotes about the habits of traditional craftsmen.

post #4390 of 4539
Haven't read it, but looks pretty interesting so I'll definitely pick it up. My woodworking books tend to be technical, so that will be a good departure.
post #4391 of 4539
Originally Posted by SkinnyGoomba View Post

Doesn't exactly look like a budget build
You can tell just by looking that the project had no budget? Interesting.......
post #4392 of 4539
Hah, There is a fairly large chasm between not being a 'budget build' and being a 'no budget build'.
post #4393 of 4539
Casa IV
Elche, Spain

post #4394 of 4539
For all the critics who use the word 'derivative' as a pejorative to dismiss or devalue a work.

post #4395 of 4539
Perhaps, but that video doesn't really make the case...
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