Not a bad idea. I'll have to search for some in 12oz.@Thin White Duke Both tailors seem to favor a higher roll, at least initially. With time they may roll a little lower. Either way, I like how the lapels are very three dimensional without being heavy or stiff.This shade of tobacco was supposed to be less red, amirite @dieworkwear? This pic was taken in the shade at 9:30am; although it has a bit of mottling it looks brighter in the midday sun.